Sorry to take one comment and run with it, but...
"Classic design still works in other vehicles--seen pictures of the next generation Ford Thunderbird, anyone?"
Isn't that the one with the carburated, pushrod V-8, beam axle rear, four-speed manual, and drums on all corners? The one that can run on leaded gas because it has no catalytic converter? Maybe not.
For little more than the price of a lowly Honda S-2000 You could have a car that is based on the Lincoln LS, that looks retro but is chock full of 'bags, ABS and other 1990's technology. Cool. Who needs 9000RPM redlines and 120hp/liter anyway?
My point is that the bicycle equivalent would be a TIG'd aluminum frame with painted-on lugs, silk-look nylon clinchers, and STI cable stops shaped like downtube shifters. It would probably be a good performer for the money, but it would be quite unlike the classic bike it emulates. These "modern classic" cars (P.T. Cruiser, New Beetle, T-bird) are just existing platforms (Neon, Golf, LS) that have been re-skinned and repositioned (repriced). In some cases this comes at the expense of practicality.
Modern cars, like modern bikes, are simply much better for the vast majority of end users. Fringe group fanatics like ourselves and the street-rod set are not unwarranted in their nostalgia and for them the old stuff may actually better meet their needs. However, this is only because we are willing to suffer the many drawbacks of old products to gain some benefits that would be totally lost on most of the population.
Would you put a teenager in 1960's vehicle when it came time for her to learn to drive? Neither would I, nor would I deny a new rider STI, clipless pedals, and modern brakes and tires. If nothing else, the new stuff is safer.
So, no I don't think turning product managers retro is going to revive tubulars and friction shifting (at least I hope not), it will only introduce a new cosmetic standard.
Tom less retro, more grouchy Dalton
> I can't afford the prices some of these parts are
> rising to, and think it's
> a good thing--this is a repeat, but I want to see
> executives and product
> planners in the bike biz become fascinated by the
> fact that a bike with
> "only" five gears on the freewheel can be worth 5K,
> and a derailleur not
> made for indexed operation in a dedicated system
> more than 1K. Please,
> vintage collectors, riders, and restorers in Japan,
> make friends with some
> Shimano employees--and let them ride your bikes!
> Classic design still works
> in other vehicles--seen pictures of the next
> generation Ford Thunderbird,
> anyone? Let's all whisper in the ears of any
> product folks who will listen;
> there still is a market for road bikes that don't
> look like BMX iron and
> ride like jackhammers.
>
> David Feldman
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Art Smith" <ahsmith@guhsd.k12.az.us>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2001 8:48 AM
> Subject: [CR]E-bay prices
>
>
> > I find the trends for prices of vintage bike and
> bike parts to be an
> > interesting conundrum. On the one hand , this is
> mostly about disposable
> > income, people with the resources to spend on
> nonessential commodities
> > (insert art, Armani suits, antiques, etc., etc.)
> One could argue that
> > the money spent on a derailleur would be better
> spent feeding or housing
> > those who live off the bottom of the world's
> culture, but suggesting
> > that isn't going to make it so. The rich, and
> those who can afford the
> > kind of prices certain vintage memorabilia are
> commanding, are if not
> > rich, at least tapped into a source of disposable
> income that most of us
> > can't match. It would be hard for me as a public
> school teacher to throw
> > a two week's paycheck at a Simplex derailleur and
> still not match the
> > current bid. I'm not crying about what I make for
> a living; I
> > acknowledge that how one spends one money is a
> personal choice. I might
> > not like the way things are going (I can't hang
> with the big boys), but
> > the collector is free to pay what he wants, and
> the dealer is free to
> > get the most bang for his buck. Welcome to free
> trade!
> > The other side of the question for me is what
> happens to an realm of
> > collectable items when the prices for the parts
> exceed the whole. It
> > happened in the pressed steel toy truck world
> years ago, when not only
> > were lesser valued, complete trucks cannibalized
> to make the higher
> > values version, but an industry of repo parts made
> originality an
> > obsolete question for a lot of buyers. The bike
> industry is already
> > played this out with reproduced versions of the
> Phantom, Colombia 5
> > star, etc. The thing that would gum up the works
> right now would be if
> > some started manufacturing knock-off replicas of
> these high end bikes
> > and parts!
> > I can get bugged by all of this because on some
> level I can't be a part
> > of it. Parts or bikes that I would like are out of
> my reach. It's funny,
> > I'll never be able to afford a 2 million dollar
> house, but I don't get
> > bugged when someone buys one one. But there are 2
> things that I have at
> > my disposal as a lover and collector of vintage
> bicycles that can't be
> > entirely altered by the heavy pricing phenomena.
> One is finding stuff.
> > Once pieces get into the higher echelon of
> collecting, they never come
> > down. But there is still stuff out there. (E-bay,
> etc. is rapidly
> > destroying that) but I can still find collectable
> items. I can also look
> > to collect things that are high quality, but not
> the top of the heap.
> > (The backside of this is that any dealer with a
> modem now thinks "any"
> > Simplex derailleur is worth big bucks.) But I have
> faith. The other is
> > keeping stuff in a network of fair pricing. I try
> to barter when I can
> > and to barter for the price I paid for it, rather
> than it's so called
> > value. The men I trade with operate on that same
> level. I'm not working
> > on that 2 million dollar house by gouging my
> friend. Recently, I found
> > a mint, Shimano 600 Centurion that is a nice
> rider and a '38 Raleigh
> > Golden Arrow from it's original owner. Fight the
> Power!
> >
> > Art Smith
> > I can only pedal one bike at a time anyway
> > Turning up the heat in Phoenix
> >
> >
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> > Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
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