Re: [CR]Spectrum frame and brazing

(Example: Framebuilders:Richard Moon)

Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 19:42:34 -0400
From: "Joe Bender-Zanoni" <joebz@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [CR]Spectrum frame and brazing
In-reply-to: <75d04b48050923111565832aa@mail.gmail.com>
To: kurt@fineartscrimshaw.com
References: <20050923.073101.15074.554852@webmail02.lax.untd.com>
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
cc: OROBOYZ@aol.com
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org

Silver brazing is used for aerospace parts because it is stronger and more predictable as opposed to brass brazing.

Joe Bender-Zanoni Great Notch, NJ

Kurt Sperry wrote:
>Better in what empirical, quantifiable as opposed to theoretical sense? I
>understand the theoretical advantages of silver brazing. Is there any
>measurable or demonstrable objective difference between brass brazed and
>silver brazed framesets all else equal?
> Kurt Sperry
>Bellingham WA
>
> On 9/23/05, brianbaylis@juno.com <brianbaylis@juno.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Dale,
>>
>>Silver brazing of frame tubes is clearly better for the tubing. The fact
>>that brass brazeing doesn't actually distroy the frame is a non-issue in
>>
>>
>my
>
>
>>mind. The only people building custom frames with brass are the ones who
>>experienced difficulties with silver from improper use early on in their
>>experience, and instead of figureing out how to use it decided to use bra
>>
>>
>ss
>
>
>>because it does not require the same amount of care and attention in the
>>cleaning and assembly process. That is why factory built bikes are brazed
>>with brass; they don't want to take the time to clean and fit the parts m
>>
>>
>ore
>
>
>>precisely.
>>
>>Sure, brass works. Silver is better.
>>
>>Brian Baylis
>>La Mesa, CA
>>Debate? I don't think so.
>>
>>-- OROBOYZ@aol.com wrote:
>>In a message dated 9/22/2005 11:13:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>>fred_rednor@yahoo.com writes:
>>
>><< I might be mistaken but it looks as though Tom Kellog use both silver
>>and
>>bronze brazing rods on this frame. The rear dropout areas appear to be
>>attached using bronze rod (which "fills" better) whereas most of the othe
>>
>>
>r
>
>
>>joints
>>appear to have been
>>done with silver rod. Is that truly the case? >>
>>
>>Sure!
>>Virtually all modern USA custom builders have done that.. the brass fills
>>the
>>big voids at the drop out ends and, the theory goes, is less of a heat
>>issue
>>there cause the parts are so chunky.
>>Silver is used the rest of the joints because the gaps are so close and
>>you
>>have thin stuff to deal with which, the theory continues, would be
>>otherwise be
>>damaged by the higher heat that brass requires.
>>As you may infer from my phraseology, some pooh pooh all that heat build
>>up
>>stuff and point to the Euro builders who have built a zillion bikes with
>>brass
>>and suffer relatively no failures due to apparent overheating. The debate
>>rages on.....
>>
>>Dale Brown
>>Greensboro, NC USA
>>_______________________________________________
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
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>>
>
>
>
>--
>fineartscrimshaw.com http://fineartscrimshaw.com