John
I can't answer your question about which handlebar is correct. One of my GR's was the result of a project that Bud Morrison from Tempe Bike undertook in the mid-seventies...he obtained several GR F/F, and built them up with all campy NR including brakes. It has Cinelli old logo bar and stem, Brooks Prof saddle, original red benotto bar tape. I ran into the original owner 20 years ago and tried to talk him into selling the bike to me, but he declined. He only rode the bike a few times (it's too big for him). It spent 30 years in his bedroom. He saved my number all those years and called last year, and sold it to me. It is completely original as to the day he bought it, but probably not original as to the configuration intended by Motobecane. It is close to being an out-of-the box bike...looks like it did the day Bud built it...not a mark on it. It is a bit short (23") for me, but I can't bear to sell it. It hangs on the wall over my desk out in the study...my only queen.
The other GR started as a F/F, my only ebay purchase, and it's a hot rod...Bars are Cinelli 64-42 with old logo stem, Campy levers and calipers, campy hi-flange hubs with Weinman rims. 70's Ideale saddle, Stronglight headset, TA BB, Stronglight Crankset with drilled rings, Simplex shifters with Super LJ RD. The bike certainly isn't "correct", but it is correct for me. It's a looker and the ride is, well, you know.
My thoughts about "Correct": "Correct" has it's place...many of my bikes are correct right down to original tires, and those bikes have places of honor in my garage (no cars allowed!). But some I have changed...my '72 Paramount P-15 has Campy side pulls thanks to drop bolts. I know it shows my shallow side, but the side pulls look better on that bike than the original Weinmann center pull brakes. My Italian Masi started with NR crank set (correct) then SR (incorrect), and now Stronglight (completely incorrect-bad boy!). My 1950 WF Holdsworth Cyclone(thanks Ken Wallace)...Stronglight 49D. I have a beautiful old (60's) Zeus crankset that is going to end up on one of my bikes, and it sure won't be correct. These bikes share equal places of honor.
Of course, I save the original parts for those who will follow me. It's the 'correct' thing to do.
So, John. There are many experts who post daily to this list, and they will be able to advise you as to the correct bar and stem for your bike. But what I think you should do is find a bar and stem that fit you, fit your bike. Then go ride that baby every day!
Pat Moffat Tempe AZUSA ----- Original Message ----- From: John Wirt<mailto:frankensaab@earthlink.net> To: Pat Moffat<mailto:rocketman_531@msn.com> ; 'Donald Gillies'<mailto:gillies@cs.ubc.ca> ; classicrendezvous@bikelist.org<mailto:classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> ; Tory Werne<mailto:twerne@bellsouth.net> Cc: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net<mailto:jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net> ; frankensaab@earthlink.net<mailto:frankensaab@earthlink.net> ; moschika@hotmail.com<mailto:moschika@hotmail.com> ; Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com<mailto:Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2007 9:50 AM Subject: Re: [CR]Grand Jubile or Grand Record?? (now headbadges..)
Pat, I just checked my 76, it's a gold badge. BTW, this discussion is great! Finally some chatter about a bike I actually own! So, what are the "correct" bars and stem for these beasts? Mine has a Nitto "Pearl 9" stem and Nitto Universidade (sp?) bars w/ Weinmann "safety" lever brakes. The PO says he had the levers installed at the time of purchase because he planned to use the bike for touring. I don't like them and the bars are too narrow, so what are my other options here?
John Wirt Boise, ID USA
-----Original Message----- From: Pat Moffat Sent: Jan 31, 2007 9:24 AM To: 'Donald Gillies' , classicrendezvous@bikelist.org<mailto:classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Tory Werne Cc: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net<mailto:jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>, frankensaab@earthlink.net<mailto:frankensaab@earthlink.net>, moschika@hotmail.com<mailto:moschika@hotmail.com>, Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com<mailto:Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com> Subject: Re: [CR]Grand Jubile or Grand Record?? (now headbadges..)
Tory Werne suggests that the Jubilee headbadge is lined in silver, the Record headbadge is lined in gold...(see full post below)
I have 2 identical mid-seventies Moto Grand Records (black with red, Reynolds 531 frame incl. fork blades, campy dropouts), EXCEPT one has a silver lined headbadge, the other is lined in gold. Never noticed the difference before.
Pat Moffat Tempe, AZUSA Is the plural Motobecanes Grand Record or Motobecane Grand Records? ----- Original Message ----- From: Tory Werne<mailto:twerne@bellsouth.net> To: 'Donald Gillies'<mailto:gillies@cs.ubc.ca> ; classicrendezvous@bikelistorg<mailto:classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Cc: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net<mailto:jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net> ; frankensaab@earthlink.net<mailto:frankensaab@earthlink.net> ; moschika@hotmail.com<mailto:moschika@hotmail.com> ; Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com<mailto:Nipponcomet@wmconnect.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 8:46 PM Subject: RE: [CR]Grand Jubile or Grand Record??
RE: Motobecane Grand Jubile'
Don and list :
RE: As the grand record is/was a campy bike, it should have campagnolo dropouts. As the grand jubilee is/was a huret bike, it should have huret
dropouts.
I don't claim to be the authority on all Motobecanes, but I need to step in on this one. I own a Grand Jubile' from 1978 with Campagnolo dropouts. Also, with minimal web searching you can find a one year off-topic catalog that shows the Grand Jubilee (now spelled with two "e"s) offered in lugless Columbus and Campagnolo Derailleurs, while the Grand Record is no longer offered. I've been watching these for a while trying to answer the
questions of this very thread. It would seem the comparisons are vintage specific. I "think" I may have spotted a detail from the 70's machines ... somebody please chime in if they know for sure. It sure looks like the Grand Record received a gold trimmed headbadge, while the Grand Jubile' received the same round badge in silver trim. This is strictly an observation from eBay offered photos, and NOT backed up with catalogs or Grand Record ownership.
Comments / Catalog owners?
Tory Werne Woodstock, Georgia USA ----------------------
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