That percentage seems wildly exaggerated. Out of the hundreds (maybe over a thousand) of vintage steel bikes I've worked on here, I can only think of a handful, maybe four or five, that have had INTERNAL rust issues bad enough to warrant tube replacements. Chrome-moly and manganese-moly steels are quite rust-resistant, compared to milder steels. It takes a lot to eat them away. Most of the time it's the fault of an inattentive owner, who doesn't allow a frame to dry out after a wet ride. One of the failures was an OT Fat Chance MTB with no vent from the seat tube to the BB shell. Another was an obscure make of frame brought to the US from Northern Europe. Both of these probably got ridden hard and put away wet many times.
Sometimes the culprit is chrome plating. As already noted, chrome plating leaves behind corrosive chemicals that must be rinsed off. This usually isn't a problem, but several of the cases I've seen were English-made frames without vent holes in the top tube or seatstays. During the plating process, the solution's surface tension becomes essentially zero when electrified. If there is the slightest void or pore in the brazed joint, the solution will get through it. But when the juice is turned off, it can't get back out again. One frame's seatstays were literally full of solution. When holes appeared during media blasting, water poured out.
So yes, I've seen it, but not anywhere near his 90%. There are undoubtedly climates and microclimates and storage situations that can cause serious rust issues, but in my experience they are rare.
Greg Reiche CyclArt, Inc. Vista, CA USA
-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces+shop=cyclart.com@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces+shop=cyclart.com@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of Kurt Sperry Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 11:21 AM Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR] Uhoh..urago on ebay
How many people here have personally as opposed to it happening to a friend, cousin etc. had classic steel frames experience an actual structural failure due solely to rust? I've never seen or heard of it happening but have learned not to put much weight in my own narrow anecdotal experience. If Fraysee is anywhere close to correct there should be hundreds or more probably thousands of such tales out there to be related by list members.
How about a show of hands?
Kurt Sperry Bellingham, Washington USA
On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 8:36 AM, Charles Andrews <chasds@mindspring.com> wrote:
> Mike F wrote:
>
> Forty year old professional bikes, built with thin seamless tubing, that
> have the original factory paint jobs, 90% of the time are not safe to ride
> as they decay from the inside, just like termites that eat out and stop when
> they reach the paint, the beam looks ok but the building falls down.
>
> I have to say, I wondered about that. Apart from anything else, re-painting a frame will not do anything to prevent rust from the inside out. Preventing that requires other measures.
>
> So I was struck by the logical disconnect.
>
> Charles Andrews
> Los Angeles
>
>
>
>
> It is impossible to begin to learn that
> which one thinks one already knows.
> --Epictetus
>
> _______________________________________________
>