Re: [CR] Raleigh/Campy Question

(Example: Production Builders:LeJeune)

Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:20:37 -0800 (PST)
From: "Tom Dalton" <tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [CR] Raleigh/Campy Question
To: Eric Elman <tr4play@home.com>
Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org


Eric,

Somewhere in all my rhetoric, I was trying to make a a few points. Most English-threaded BB's will fit most English-threaded frames. The same can be said for Italian threaded BB's and frames. The only exceptions I can think of are when you have an odd frame where the threading / shell-width combination is not the norm. This can happen on some oddly spec'ed bikes like old Raleighs or Cinellis or when repairs have been made to the BB shell. (I have had to set up bikes like this on a couple of occasions. If English threads get severely damaged the shell can be reamed and tapped to Italian, or if you really botch a facing job you can end up with a too-narrow shell that has to be taken down to 68mm. Either way you have a 68 mm Italian BB). Bottom line is that you are not usually trying to find a BB to fit your frame, but rather to fit your crankarms.

And on that matter... we need to be cautious about simply measuring the overall length of a spindle and then trying to match it. Even assuming that the origional spindle is correct, the replacement could still be very wrong even if it is the same length. Consider the following: 1)The relative amounts of spindle on the left and right ends can vary considerably, with most newer spindles being symmetrical. 2) Some spindles are smaller at the end, allowing the arm to press further toward the frame. (Note that this is not the same as "taper". Almost all cotterless spindles are tapered at 2 degrees (or is it three?). I believe it is the variation in size, not angle, that perpetuates the misuse of the term "taper".) 3)Spindles that are nominally 68mm (for example) can have different spacing between the races to accomodate different cup wall thicknesses (On NR vs record BB's for example.)

In the end, unless you have a nice stock of parts and time to experiment, it is often easiset to use a BB designed to go with the crankset. In your case an English record, NR or GS would do the trick.


--- Eric Elman wrote:


> Hi Tom,
>
> Thanks for the reply. My question was really just
> as simple as written. My
> International had a TA crankset with a Philwood BB
> and I am returing it back
> to original. I just didn't know what length to look
> for. Interestingly,
> I've had relpy's that it took a 111, 112, 113, and
> 114-115. The respondent
> advising that 112 is proper still has his
> International which he bought new
> so I suppose that's as correct as can be.
>
> Regards,
>
> Eric
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Tom Dalton <tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com>
> To: Eric Elman <tr4play@home.com>
> Cc: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 12:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [CR] Raleigh/Campy Question
>
>
> > Eric
> > I think the simple (smart-mouthed)answer to your
> > question is, "the proper spindle length to fit an
> NR
> > double to your International is the length of an
> NR
> > double bottom bracket spindle." But, as has
> already
> > been indicated by another lister, this length
> changes
> > depending on wether you're using a pre- or
> post-CPSC
> > crankset.
> >
> > In addition to this there are perhaps two other
> points
> > of concern:
> > 1) Modern spindles tend to be symetrical while
> that
> > vintage of Campy had a good bit more length to the
> > right of the right race than to the left of the
> left
> > race. Fitting a modern spindle that is the same
> > length as the proper NR may put the chainrings a
> bit
> > closer to the stay than is ideal. The left
> crankarm
> > would also be farther from the frame in this
> scenario.
> > 2) (Real Raleigh buffs chime in now...) Perhaps
> we've
> > missed the point of your question. Are you really
> > asking which NR double spindle fits the BB shell
> of
> > your frame? I say this because a friend of mine
> had a
> > custom Raleigh that had a 70 mm bottom bracket
> shell.
> > At least that's what I remember. It was a hastle
> to
> > compile the parts to make an
> > English-threaded/Italian-width BB.
> >
> >
> > --- Eric Elman <tr4play@home.com> wrote:
> > > Quick question for the Raleigh International
> experts
> > > (Larry, Steve, .....),
> > > what would the proper BB spindle length be for
> the
> > > standard Campagnolo NR
> > > double on a 1974 Raleigh International?
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance,
> > >
> > > Eric Elman
> > >
> > >
> > >
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