This has been an interesting thread to follow. I have a couple of questions and comments. On the subject of cast vs. stamped lugs from a structural standpoint, I understand that the rigidity of the cast lug concentrates stress at the lug / tube junction rather than allowing some flexibility throughout the joint, as is the case with a stamped lug. This makes tube failure more likely in these transition areas. My question is given the use of reasonably dimensioned tubing (.9 or .8 mm butts) and sound construction methods, how much of a problem is this in practice? And does the use of heat treated high strength steel tubing compound this? A comment on cast prefab plug in stuff: If all Henry James components (lugs, bb, ends crown), and all the things in his list are used to construct a frame, is this frame more a Hank Folson frame glued together by Joe Blow, or a Joe Blow? A builders style and skill are often reflected in the way the ends and seat cluster are done. Plug in fork ends and seat lugs with integral seatstay sockets homogenize things, leaving little scope for individuality. I happened to see a Carrera at a local shop recently, and lo and behold, everything from Bringheli's catalog! I suppose that the building process is streamlined, involving fewer and simpler fitting and finishing operations, which allows the builder to increase his small profit margin. Maybe not a bad thing, but something important is lost. And if utility is the object, tig welding streamlines things further still. I believe the mountain bike played a large role in the demise of the classic/vintage cycle. Cyclists were said to be a conservative bunch who approached innovation cautiously. The mountain bike revolution broke that wide open with all kinds of" out of the box "thinking (such as electric welding of lightweight tubing). In addition, all sorts of people were attracted to this trendy new form of cycling who didn't know or care about the tradition or esthetic that we value. I believe the new era road bikes are designed to appeal to such people-the prevailing esthetic has changed. Having said all of this, I feel the "pinnacle" is represented by a handcrafted, lugged steel frame equipped with C Record with Delta parts. I'm sure I'll catch some flak for not choosing NR or SR . But I feel that this was the last evolution of the traditional Gran Sport rear gear, as well as the last of the non-index, toe clip, thread on freewheel parts. When I think of "classic bicycle" I always think of my friend Paul LeMaire's Herne Hill. A traditional British roadrace frame, with longpoint lugs, full wrapover stays, fully sloping integral crown, big white block lettering, he had it set up with a Zeus Criterium cranks, Zeus G.S. hubs, a Zeus seatpin and pedals, Campy NR changers, universal Super 68's, a Brooks Pro, 3ttt Record bars/stem, Arc- en-ciels, etc. Boy I loved that bike as a kid! And it illustrates part of what is missing today: variety. Enough for now.
Best Regards, Wes Gadd