Re: [CR]Re: Quality of bikes (was Masi vs Waterford)

(Example: Framebuilders:Alex Singer)

From: "Thomas Rawson" <twrawson@worldnet.att.net>
To: "Bob Reid" <bob.reid@btconnect.com>
Cc: <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
References: <B7B26691.7D58%bob.reid@btconnect.com>
Subject: Re: [CR]Re: Quality of bikes (was Masi vs Waterford)
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 09:14:23 -0700


Hi Bob, Please hijack away. Evolution of question can lead to evolution of answers. I struggled with question a bit, not wanting to lead answers. Was hoping to stimulate a dialogue that evolved the various components of how we value things - in this case bicycles. People often get into various rational descriptions of why they prefer something - the ride, fit and finish for example but then market price doesnt always follow. The passion for Masi, as an example, expressed by this group and fed by the various postings that we all read, would seem to contribute to a mystique that elevates the brand (mark). Coincidentally was looking at a nicely restored Masi other day in shop that sells Waterford. The one to one comparison on the physical - visual stuff available got me thinking about why prices were where they were.

Your variation: "Leaving cost and componentry aside, and on the assumption that they are all available as "new", what modern or vintage classic steel/lugged frame would you buy and state why ?" gives me these problems: price is the measure of value, cant leave to side - trying to explain that. If all available as new then the attributes of age and "history" arent present.

Thanks for input. Flying Gates are cool. Tom Rawson Oakland, CA

Cost (think were talking price in this case) is the valuation of the physical frame itself - tubing, lugs, brazing, paint, transfers, angles and of course the subjective does it fit. PLUS componentry mdern vs old and which do you prefer - value higer


----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Reid
To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:29 AM
Subject: Re: [CR]Re: Quality of bikes (was Masi vs Waterford)



> I'm probably just thick, and not wanting to hijack the question, wouldn't it
> have been better phrased as ;
>
> "Leaving cost and componentry aside, and on the assumption that they are all
> available as "new", what modern or vintage classic steel/lugged frame would
> you buy and state why ?"
>
> I'd find that a lot easier to answer..........And I'd probably get a better
> idea from other answers of what "values" the group considers important or
> otherwise.
>
> It's not that I don't want to answer the question, but as I've seen neither
> a Masi from 25 years ago or a Waterford from today, you might as well ask me
> to compare a Caminargent with a Rover Safety.
>
> Bob Reid
> Stonehaven
> Scotland