Before this becomes another out-of-contol, not-on-topic, tit-for-tat, free for all - please note what I said was with tongue firmly placed in cheek ! It certainly wasn't my intention to get a vote on it.
How about some more factual answers to Kens "Cinelli" mail instead !
If anyone feels the need to discuss this further I'm quite happy to do so off list - Just don't expect me to pass derisory comments about the bikes I sell to make a living, and feed the hobby (I only have one face)
best regards
Bob Reid
Stonehaven
Scotland.