Hello gang,
I must say that the comment (by Fred) below makes since but as far as packaged parts are concerned, many top flight components are not packaged well enough from the factory or by suppliers to qualify for Mark's 2 or 3rd level from the top as new! Shall we say shop worn out of the box.
My shop experience over the last 30 odd years also indicates that almost no production bike has ever meet the standard of Mint+++ (IMHO) and most would fall several levels below that as new as well.
Having said this exceptions must abound. The best production bike I have ever seen out of the box (and it's not a real production machine in the classic sense) was a Ross Signature racing and Touring bike by Mr. Tommy Kellogg now of Spectrum Cycles. As many list members know this was really a fine hand built bike from a production company. The paint, assembly and packaging were superb. Most people (builders) concerned about their work are very careful in this regards as well.
Regards,
Gilbert Anderson Raleigh, NC USA
In a message dated 11/26/01 5:11:38 PM, fred_rednor@yahoo.com writes:
<< > You don't spend rare coins and you don't post
> mail with rare stamps. If a part is shopworn and also
> listed as mint, it will still perform its function as
> if it just arrived from the factory.
Richard,
If coins/stamps aren't related closely enough to bicycles
for your tastes, how about cameras? In fact, I'm sure I was
on a camera auction Web site when I noticed the rating system
that I think would best apply to classic bicycle stuff.
In that system (as with every system I've seen used to
seriously grade a collectable item) Mint meant unused and
essentially perfect cosmetically. NIB is a specialization
of Mint - i.e. unused and in the original packaging. There
was a Near Mint category for items that are unused but with
_very_ mild blemishes. I suppose that the Simplex derailleur
which prompted this discussion would be considered Near Mint.
No doubt a shop worn but unused item will function as
well as a cosmetically perfect one. But cosmetic damage
(that's what shop wear is) reduces the value of any item.
Otherwise why should a manufacturer even bother to package
items like cranksets so as to prevent scratches during
transit?
Best regards,
Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
>>