Valid observation, Bruce, except I think many list members would be equally enthralled by the tale of the transformation of Carlton to Raleigh and the doings at Worksop and later Ilkston, if we had members to tell it first hand as we have Jim nad Brian to tell the Masi saga. I must confess, I'm not a great Masi fan, preferring French bikes, but the tale is compelling nonetheless. I'd imagine UK, with a much richer cycling history, has many more tales worth telling and hearing, and I, for one, would love to hear them.
Regards,
Jerry Moos
brucerobbins@worldmailer.com wrote:
> Thanks for breaking cover, Art, and submitting such an intelligent
post. You hit the nail on the head over and over again.
>
> As a Scot living in Scotland, the Confente thing is totally alien to
me, too, and, I suspect, to many living in Australia, Japan, Europe and
other parts of the globe. I've no doubt the bikes are great and the
history may be of interest to some people.
>
> However, other marques/history hold a similar interest for others. The
Flying Scot marque has a tremendous history behind it and the factory
where the bikes were made was loaded with intrigue. If Bob Reid and I
and a few others were to fill the CR list with posts about Rattray's
Glasgow workshop, 99% of list members would rightly be fed up and switch
off. Similarly, 99% of list members who have never seen and have little
interest in a Mario Confente-built Masi get fed up reading about that
particular obsession.
>
> Aware that this is, or is supposed to be a global list, Bob and I
mainly discuss the Flying Scot stuff off-list. It would be nice if the
Masi mafia were able to offer the rest of us the same courtesy. Even
better, why doesn't someone start up a Mario Confente/Masi website where
all the information about the bikes can be made available to anyone who
is interested?
>
> I also agree with Art that too much is made of Campagnolo. It seems
that amongst certain list members, a bike isn't worth having unless it
has "full SR" or similar. These people don't have collections of bikes:
they just have collections of frames because the components are all the
same. Once you've checked out the frame, there is no point in looking
any further.
>
> However, don't give up on the list, Art. For all the sandal-wearing
members of the personality cult, there are many others who contribute a
tremendous amount and who don't do so just to appear more knowledgeable
than anyone else.
>
> Bruce
>
> Art Smith wrote:
>
> > In response to Brian's observation that a small group of the 400
members
> > contribute to most of the commentary on this site and his call for
what
> > others think, here goes. I introduced myself and added a few posts
in the
> > months that I've been lurking around here. I came on in the middle
of one of
> > the emotional slams about some dead guy and commented that perhaps
I'm in
> > the wrong spot, but was assured by several private e-mails that the
> > substance of this site is about bikes, and to hang with it. I've
spent a
> > number of years on oldroads and have found that environment to be an
honest,
> > supportive forum. Realizing that the discussions here were a bit
different
> > in topic and tone, I read everything you've written in order to get
a
> > handle on what this site is about.
> > I think there are some really straightforward people here. I think
> > their knowledge and opinions and advice are worth seeking out. I
think
> > others ought to ride more and talk less. I don't get the
Masi/Confente thing
> > and
> > frankly think it's way overplayed. Sorry if that "hurts anyone's
feelings."
> > I don't get the hurt feelings thing. I think a free exchange of
ideas ought
> > to preclude hurt feelings. I think that a set of rules ought toapply
to
> > everyone, not just big names in the hobby with reps. Suppose I have
a
> > legitimate, fact-based beef with a celebrity. Can I air it here as
> > righteously as I could against a no name e-bay dealer? I'm not sure.
> > I don't want to get off on a rant here, but a number of us have left
because
> > of the overwhelming sense of attitude that permeates a strand of
this site.
> > It is by no means the whole site, but it is similar to the attitude
many
> > high tech, weekend roadies, dressed like Lance, have. It's the "I
have the
> > big guns, f... you, you can't hang with us" attitude regardless of
how well
> > you ride but rather based on their idea of what Bicycling Magazine
just
> > designated as the hottest $4000 road machine. It's ironical that
attitude
> > shows up here. It appears at times that the PC thing is to adore
Confente,
> > Masis and Campagnolo and heaven help you if you don't. Brian showed
an
> > example of a new frame he was working on. I had a criticism of the
style of
> > the frame from an artistic point of view. I wanted to share my
observations
> > in an art critigue sense. However, I knew that if I did, my
criticism of the
> > frame would be seen as a personal attack on Brian (which it would
not have
> > been) and
> > that a round of fans would rush to his defense. The cult of
personality is
> > at times rampant here, for both the living and the dead.
> > While I am not a framebuilder nor do I make my living in the world
of
> > bicylcles, vintage or not, as a collector and lover of bikes I have
an
> > interest in many of the topics discussed here. One can't legislate
honesty
> > or open mindedness or compassion on this site any more than one can
trust
> > that a member won't bid against another member on an auction. This
site
> > isn't everything I want, but it has its moments. This is just the
way I see
> > it. I don't know, I could be wrong.
> >
> > Art Smith
> >
>
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