it depends on whether the part was reproduced or whether it was forged. e-RICHIE at work
On Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:05:08 -0700 "Jim McCoin" <j.mccoin@attbi.com>
writes:
> If Campy goes after some one who reproduces a part that has not been
> produced in thirty years can I sue them for injuries when my twenty
> seven
> year old crank broke and dropped me on my head . How many attorneys
> are in
> the audience?
> Jim "how far will it go" McCoin
> Fremont Ca.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 12:04 PM
> Subject: Classicrendezvous digest, Vol 1 #1222 - 23 msgs
>
>
> > Send Classicrendezvous mailing list submissions to
> > classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://www.bikelist.org/
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org
> >
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> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more
> specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Classicrendezvous digest..."
> >
> >
> > CR
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Re: eBay item/campag item (Fred Rafael Rednor)
> > 2. Re: Campy Repro Hoods/ Forgeries/ Reproductions... (Fred
> Rafael
> Rednor)
> > 3. Forgeries and Masis (CBKNYC@aol.com)
> > 4. Legal issues for repro logos (long) (CBKNYC@aol.com)
> > 5. This Forgery discussion is silly (Wornoutguy@aol.com)
> > 6. Re: forgeries (WTrikerider@cs.com)
> > 7. Re: eBay item/campag item (NortonMarg@aol.com)
> > 8. Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item (Chuck
> Schmidt)
> > 9. Re: Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> (swampmtn)
> > 10. ebay item - mafac "racer" brakeset (ben kamen)
> > 11. Re: eBay item/campag item (swampmtn)
> > 12. TA 3-pin chainrings?? (Neill Currie)
> > 13. very sorry - re: mafac (ben kamen)
> > 14. Re: eBay item/campag item (Fred Rafael Rednor)
> > 15. (no subject) (Harvey M. Sachs)
> > 16. Re: TA 3-pin chainrings?? (Sheldon Brown)
> > 17. "open G" lever pic (swampmtn)
> > 18. Re: TA 3-pin chainrings?? (Wdgadd@aol.com)
> > 19. Re: eBay item/campag item (David Goerndt)
> > 20. Re: Protecting new paint jobs (M4Campy@aol.com)
> > 21. open<G> lever auction question (Richard M Sachs)
> > 22. WTB: 26.6 post with setback (Douglas R. Brooks)
> > 23. Re: Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> (TGMetals98@aol.com)
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Sat, 6 Apr 2002 20:20:53 -0800 (PST)
> > From: Fred Rafael Rednor <fred_rednor@yahoo.com>
> > Reply-To: fred_rednor@yahoo.com
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > > http://ebay.com/
> > > >
> > >
> > > ...Seems like a decent guy to deal with...
> >
> > Maybe so but he ought to be more careful about the dates
> > he attributes to the parts he's selling. Those shifters
> > are most likely from the 60's, perhaps even as late as
> > 1968 or 1969.
> > Regards,
> > Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Sat, 6 Apr 2002 20:38:10 -0800 (PST)
> > From: Fred Rafael Rednor <fred_rednor@yahoo.com>
> > Reply-To: fred_rednor@yahoo.com
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Campy Repro Hoods/ Forgeries/ Reproductions...
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > > Campagnolo should nip this in the bud and either
> > > make replacement parts themselves or license someone
> > > else to.
> > Why are people having such a problem with these reproductions?
> > This is no different than all the people who currently supply
> > reproduction parts for classic car restorations.
> > In fact, if you do some research on restoring classic balloon
> > tire bicycles, you'll find that this situation already exists
> > in the cycling world. As long as the reproductions are
> > presented
> > as such, everyone is happy to have the parts available.
> > The seller is not portraying these as anything other than
> > reproduction/replacements for pieces that easily deteriorate
> > over the years and which are not going to be reproduced by
> > Campagnolo anytime soon, if ever.
> > The real danger here, is that honest people with the ability
> > to make reproductions will be dissuaded from doing so.
> > Best regards,
> > Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 3
> > From: CBKNYC@aol.com
> > Date: Sat, 6 Apr 2002 23:52:54 EST
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]Forgeries and Masis
> >
> > --- In fact, many people would say that the only true Masis are
> the ones
> > Alberto
> > --- is making now, and that any made in the US (and now Taiwan)
> are the
> > --- "reproductions" and/or "forgeries".
> >
> > Why, because Alberto is the son? Maybe his are forgeries too of
> those of
> > Faliero?
> >
> > My understanding is the owner of the "Masi" mark authorized
> Alberto to
> > continue using the Masi name in Italy, and someone else to use the
> Masi
> name
> > in the U.S.
> > That makes them both "genuine".
> >
> > But I agree this is an instance when proper use a trademark is
> confusing.
> > Unlike a fungible product (Duracell batteries made in Mexico and
> Duracell
> > batteries made in France) we assume that Alberto's and Calfornia
> Masis may
> > both be great (or not) but they are different. What avoids
> confusion is
> only
> > the California ones are properly sold here. I think the Albertos
> that get
> to
> > the US are called "Milanos" not "Masis".
> >
> > - Charles
> >
> > =====================
> > Charles B. Kramer
> > NY, NY, ordinarily, but tonight in South Bound Brook, NJ
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 4
> > From: CBKNYC@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 00:18:05 EST
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]Legal issues for repro logos (long)
> >
> > -- list members imply that making repro parts is dishonest in some
> way,
> when
> > I
> > -- do not believe this is the case with the facts at hand. '
> >
> > If a part contains the word "Campagnolo" or "Raleigh" or whatever,
> and
> does
> > NOT:
> >
> > -- come from the source that historically was identified by those
> words
> or
> >
> > -- come from a source authorized by the historic source; or
> >
> > -- contain any explanatory note ("unauthorized reproduction of")
> >
> > then the words are potentially deceptive as to source. Right?
> I'm not
> > talking law yet, just how a potential customer now or 10 years
> from now
> may
> > perceive the word "Raleigh".
> >
> > -- The legal question that needs to answered
> > -- about the Campy hoods is not how they are made nor what they
> are made
> of,
> > -- but solely whether the Campy old-style logo displayed on the
> hoods is
> > -- protected by current registration with the federal trademark
> and
> patents
> > -- office.
> >
> > Incorrect. You really ought to speak with an intellectual
> property
> lawyer.
> >
> > In the U.S. at least, trademark rights are created by USE in
> commerce. A
> > trademark can be registered on a state or federal basis (or both),
> but
> > trademark can exist before registration, without a registration,
> and after
> a
> > registration lapses for non-renewal. In the U.S. a prior USER
> even has
> > superior rights over a registrant -- and (assuming the use by
> both
> companies
> > would be likely to cause confusion) a prior user can cause the
> registration
> > by a later user to be canceled.
> >
> > Campagnolo, and anything confusingly similar ("Campy") is, of
> course,
> still a
> > very active trademark. No one other than the real source (or
> someone
> > licensed by the source) can use such words on bicycle parts
> without
> causing
> > confusion about the real source. It doesn't matter that a
> particular
> Campy
> > product is not made anymore.
> >
> > An interestingly different situation exists with companies that no
> longer
> > exist. Consider making parts labeled "Pops Brennan" (a extinct
> line of --
> I
> > think -- track bikes from Newark, NJ). There is no Pops around
> anymore t
> o
> > complain about such use, and few left who might believe there is
> a
> connection
> > between the current user of that name and any prior user. But
> while
> there
> > might not be trademark infringement in such a case, there could
> still
> > deception -- and isn't deception the purpose? I haven't
> researched this,
> but
> > my guess is some species of false advertising or unfair
> competition could
> be
> > involved.
> >
> > -- Raleigh USA has been bought/sold/franchised by several holding
> companies
> > -- since these decals were produced over 25 years ago, and
> Raleigh's
> > originals
> > -- decal designs were destroyed over 20 years ago. My subsequent
> attempts
> > for
> > -- 25 years to obtain these decals were met with Raleigh Customer
> Support
> in
> > -- the USA and England claiming "we don't have and have never seen
> those"
> > -- responses. Like the guy reproducing the Campy hoods, I have
> stepped up
> to
> > -- the plate and now offer factory duplicate parts (decals) that
> the OEM
> > -- manufacturer ignores and chooses not to reproduce for whatever
> reasons.
> >
> > To the extent anyone sees the decals and believes they are
> genuine, the
> > decals do a disservice. "Genuine" doens't mean "looks good", it
> means
> from
> > the source or authorized by the source. The fact the real source
> doesn't
> > feel like authorizing them doesn't given anyone else the right to
> make
> copies
> > -- part of owning a trademark or copyright (etc.) is the right NOT
> to use
> it.
> >
> > -- Regarding legal technicalities, I am legally protected by the
> federal
> > -- trademark facts that Raleigh never renewed its US trademark
> name or
> logo
> > for
> > -- its brands in the USA that I reproduce
> >
> > Incorrect. See above. Registration is not the key. The
> "likelihood of
> > confusion as to source" is the key. Dilution, unfair
> competition, unfair
> > advertising and other things could be involved.
> >
> > -- Therefore my decal renderings are protected by legal "freedom
> of
> speech"
> > as artistic
> > -- interpretations and exact reproductions of originals where
> Raleigh
> > -- International abandoned its trademark rights long ago.
> >
> > PUHleeze! what are you claiming to "express"? There is no
> "freedom" to
> > deceive. Now possibly YOUR products don't deceive -- I haven't
> seen
> them,
> > and by this post I mean to express general legal principles, not
> to give
> an
> > opinion on anyone's operation or products. But IF a product is
> likely to
> > cause confusion as to its source (now or 10 years from now) I
> find
> "freedom
> > of speech" a lousy defense.
> >
> > The bike biz is really odd on the subject of decals. My "Masi"
> has
> "genuine"
> > decals of Alberto Masi -- but they were put on by a company that
> did a
> > restoration in the US, and I wonder if it was authorized by
> Alberto to use
> > them. The bike is terrific and beautiful, and the *restoration
> company's*
> > logo is also on the bike -- which is a way is a certificate of
> > UNauthenticity, which maybe makes use of the logos okay.
> >
> > - Charles
> >
> > ====================
> > Charles B. Kramer New York, NY
> > cbknyc@aol.com
> > John Marshall J.D. and Law Review 1981
> > McGeorge International Program 1982
> > New York University Masters (LL.M.) Intellectual Property Law
> 1984
> > Lord, Day & Lord 1984-1987 (associate)
> > Bloodtype: unknown, but thick
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 5
> > From: Wornoutguy@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 00:38:42 EST
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]This Forgery discussion is silly
> >
> > If there was money in those hoods Campagnolo would make them. No
> one
> could
> > ever get rich making obsolete parts for our old worn out bikes.
> Get
> real
> > and think about it - only a few nutcases like myself and others
> would pay
> > anything at all for old parts it is not like making reproduction
> Rolex
> > watches they are brake hoods.
> >
> > Sam DiBartolomeo Riverside CA
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 6
> > From: WTrikerider@cs.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 03:42:18 EDT
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]Re: forgeries
> >
> > Fred Rednor and Sam Bartelolmeo have it right. I've tried to make
> the
> > comparison between classic car restoration and vintage bike
> restoration
> > before. If one is to restore a vintage bike, it is (for all
> practical
> > purposes) necessary at times to use reproduction parts. A
> restored bike
> does
> > not have the same paint, decals or tires, for example. The
> original
> > manufacturer no longer makes those items. Copies of or products
> similar
> to
> > the original must be used to restore the bike or the car. If
> reproductions
> > are not allowed then restoration in many cases becomes impossible.
> So buy
> > the copy and enjoy the bike.
> > Campagnolo could possibly bring suit out of simple orneriness
> but
> what
> > is the point? They don't make the parts and don't intend to.
> >
> > Paul Patzkowsky Longmont, Colorado
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 7
> > From: NortonMarg@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 04:23:41 EDT
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > To: LouDeeter@aol.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > In a message dated 4/6/02 2:54:28 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> LouDeeter@aol.com
> > writes:
> >
> > << And check out his other auctions. I just bought a non-vintage
> frame
> from
> > this guy in Germany. He is also the guy who was offering the
> early 70s
> Masi
> > with the recessed brakes and braze-ons. Seems like a decent guy
> to deal
> > with, at least by his emails >>
> > I heard from Matteo in Italy that cyclo24 is a she. In an earlier
> email
> > exchange that I had with cyclo, it was pretty obvious that he/she
> didn't
> > understand the difference between a tubular and a clincher. I
> agree she
> seems
> > quite nice and frequently has really great stuff.
> > Stevan Thomas
> > Alameda, CA
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 8
> > Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 02:07:34 -0800
> > From: Chuck Schmidt <chuckschmidt@earthlink.net>
> > Reply-To: chuckschmidt@earthlink.net
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> >
> > Stevan Thomas wrote:
> > >
> > > I heard from Matteo in Italy that cyclo24 is a she. In an
> earlier email
> > > exchange that I had with cyclo, it was pretty obvious that
> he/she didn't
> > > understand the difference between a tubular and a clincher.
> >
> >
> > Carsten Rehbein is a woman? Huh?!?!?
> >
> > German is his first language and English is probably his second or
> third.
> >
> > Chuck "'merican is my only language" Schmidt
> > South Pasadena, Southern California
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 9
> > From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> > To: "Chuck Schmidt" <chuckschmidt@earthlink.net>,
> > <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 08:57:37 -0400
> >
> > Carsten frequently uses his wife's email account, Tanja Rehbein.
> That's
> why
> > people sometimes think it's a woman writing.
> >
> > Alexandra Ross
> > Monroe, Ohio
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Chuck Schmidt <chuckschmidt@earthlink.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 6:07 AM
> > Subject: [CR]Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> >
> >
> > > Stevan Thomas wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I heard from Matteo in Italy that cyclo24 is a she. In an
> earlier
> email
> > > > exchange that I had with cyclo, it was pretty obvious that
> he/she
> didn't
> > > > understand the difference between a tubular and a clincher.
> > >
> > >
> > > Carsten Rehbein is a woman? Huh?!?!?
> > >
> > > German is his first language and English is probably his second
> or
> third.
> > >
> > > Chuck "'merican is my only language" Schmidt
> > > South Pasadena, Southern California
> > > _______________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 10
> > Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 09:11:52 -0400
> > From: ben kamen <ko_te_jebe@mac.com>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]ebay item - mafac "racer" brakeset
> >
> > hello,
> >
> > i have listed a mafac racer brakeset on ebay. it is complete and
> is new in
> > box. the auction ends in 5 days and has no reserve.
> >
> > i will also be listing other french goodies so check if anything
> by mafac,
> > simplex, stronglight and normandy-maillard interest you keep an
> eye on my
> > auctions. all are new in box as well.
> >
> > thankyou for looking
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 11
> > From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> > To: <fred_rednor@yahoo.com>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 09:26:01 -0400
> >
> > I have two all-original bikes, a 1961 Olmo and a 1962 Atala, both
> with
> > Campagnolo shift levers. The 1961 Olmo has "open G and open C"
> levers,
> > while the 1962 Atala has "closed G and closed C". The change must
> have
> been
> > made by 1962, or a bit earlier if Olmo was using-up stock.
> >
> > Aldo Ross
> > "close fridge and open beer"
> > Monroe, Ohio
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Fred Rafael Rednor <fred_rednor@yahoo.com>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 12:20 AM
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> >
> >
> > > > http://ebay.com/
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > ...Seems like a decent guy to deal with...
> > >
> > > Maybe so but he ought to be more careful about the dates
> > > he attributes to the parts he's selling. Those shifters
> > > are most likely from the 60's, perhaps even as late as
> > > 1968 or 1969.
> > > Regards,
> > > Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 12
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 06:34:04 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: Neill Currie <neill1234@yahoo.com>
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]TA 3-pin chainrings??
> >
> > Hi
> > I recently obtained a pair of TA Aluminum 3-pin
> > cotterless arms, in new condition. A web search
> > tracked down some 45 and 51 tooth NOS rings for
> > them, so they are rideable now.
> > Does anyone have a ring or two extra that'll fit?
> > I believe the smallest ring that will fit is a
> > 36, and I would also love something in the 39 to
> > 42 range.
> >
> > =====
> > The Bicyclist formerly known as Neill Currie, Portland, Me 04102,
> USA.
> > The Mountain Goat website is at:
> > http://www.geocities.com/
> > Mountain Goat Frameset or complete bike still wanted, 20 to 21.5
> inches c
> to t, other goatish stuff also wanted.
> > Mountain Goat Mailing list is at:
> > http://www.topica.com/
> > I have repro Mountain Goat decal sets for sale.
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 13
> > Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 09:40:57 -0400
> > From: ben kamen <ko_te_jebe@mac.com>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]very sorry - re: mafac
> >
> > hi,
> >
> > i had mistakenly forgot to add the link to the auction.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
http://ebay.com/
> > torial=0&ed=1018578516&indexURL=0&rd=1
> >
> > ben kamen - new york city
> >
> >
> > ciao, ben
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 14
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 08:04:35 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: Fred Rafael Rednor <fred_rednor@yahoo.com>
> > Reply-To: fred_rednor@yahoo.com
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > To: swampmtn <swampmtn@siscom.net>,
> classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > > I have two all-original bikes, a 1961 Olmo and a 1962
> > > Atala, both with Campagnolo shift levers. The 1961 Olmo
> > > has "open G and open C" levers, while the 1962 Atala has
> > > "closed G and closed C". The change must have been made
> > > by 1962, or a bit earlier if Olmo was using-up stock.
> > Aldo,
> > Thanks for that information. It seems that dating Campi
> > parts is always a challenge and even I (gasp!) make mistakes
> > from time to time. But back to the levers in this auction...
> > You might be amused if you closely examine the photos. (I
> > suggest clicking on the "Click Here For Supersize" option.)
> > The front and rear lever handles do not match! The lever for
> > the front is of the "closed C/G" type but the lever for the
> > rear is of the older style. You can also see that there are
> > differences in shape between the two levers. Actually, there
> > are a couple of other differences that you will notice if you
> > spend more time than is healthy examining the photo.
> > So my suspicion is that this piece comprises a '60s era set
> > for which the rear shifter has been replaced with an older
> > lever. Now I'm not accusing the seller of deliberate fraud
> > and it could be the other way around - i.e. an older set with
> > the front shifter being a replacement.
> > But it's clearly not as described...
> > Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 15
> > Date: Sun, 07 Apr 2002 10:05:20 -0100
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > From: "Harvey M. Sachs" <sachs@erols.com>
> > Subject: [CR](no subject)
> >
> > Richard (no relation) Sachs wrote:
> >
> > From: Richard M Sachs <richardsachs@juno.com>
> > Subject: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > i thought i knew it all...
> > it's an "open g" shift lever set, rare, and from
> > the early 50s.
> > is this a reproduction? a forgery?
> > definitely the stuff timelines are made for.
> > e-RICHIE...
> > who will 'try' reproducing in the a.m.!!
> >
> > http://ebay.com/
> > -- __--__--
> >
> > I'd like to see the edge-on view. The early Campy lever sets I've
> owned
> > all had very thin "necks" just above the spool that winds the
> cable. so
> > thin that generally the used ones are bent there, like an elbow.
> Not
> > discernable in this picture.
> >
> > harvey "too cynical?" sachs
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 16
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 11:06:26 -0400
> > To: Neill Currie <neill1234@yahoo.com>,
> > classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > From: Sheldon Brown <CaptBike@sheldonbrown.com>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]TA 3-pin chainrings??
> >
> > Neill Currie wrote:
> > >Hi
> > >I recently obtained a pair of TA Aluminum 3-pin
> > >cotterless arms, in new condition. A web search
> > >tracked down some 45 and 51 tooth NOS rings for
> > >them, so they are rideable now.
> > >Does anyone have a ring or two extra that'll fit?
> > >I believe the smallest ring that will fit is a
> > >36, and I would also love something in the 39 to
> > >42 range.
> >
> > I believe I can still get these new. Probably $30-40 each.
> >
> > Sheldon "TA Professionnel" Brown
> > +-------------------------------------------+
> > | Ah, but I was so much older then, |
> > | I'm younger than that now. |
> > | -Bob Dylan |
> > +-------------------------------------------+
> > Harris Cyclery, West Newton, Massachusetts
> > Phone 617-244-9772, 617-244-1040, FAX 617-244-1041
> > http://harriscyclery.com
> > Hard-to-find parts shipped Worldwide
> > http://captainbike.com
> > Useful articles about bicycles and cycling
> > http://sheldonbrown.com
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 17
> > From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>,
> > "Harvey M. Sachs" <sachs@erols.com>
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 11:39:22 -0400
> > Subject: [CR]"open G" lever pic
> >
> > OK - I have a very good picture of "open G" levers on the Olmo.
> Please
> > email if you'd like me to send it to you.
> >
> > Looking from the side, the lever is indeed thinner than the closed
> version
> > on the 1962 Atala, the cable slot is narrower, and the lettering
> area on
> > both (1961 Olmo and 1962 Atala) is closer to the cable hole than
> on later
> > levers
> >
> > Does that mean I still need "open O" and "open P" to complete my
> collection?
> > ;>)
> >
> > Aldo Ross
> > Monroe, Ohio
> > sunny and warming nicely for a ride on the ugly silver Legnano
> "Roma"
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 18
> > From: Wdgadd@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 11:52:54 EDT
> > Subject: Re: [CR]TA 3-pin chainrings??
> > To: CaptBike@sheldonbrown.com, neill1234@yahoo.com,
> > classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > At some point in the not too distant future, I'd like to use
> T.A.
> rings
> > (or a single T.A. ring) on a pair of Campagnolo 3 pin cranks.
> Could anyone
> > who has done this advise on what hardware works best? Thanks!
> >
> > Best Regards,
> > Wes Gadd
> > Unionville,CT
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 19
> > From: "David Goerndt" <davidg@iag.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 12:21:21 -0400
> >
> > : Re: [CR]eBay item/campag item
> >
> >
> > > You might be amused if you closely examine the photos. (I
> > > suggest clicking on the "Click Here For Supersize" option.)
> > > The front and rear lever handles do not match! The lever for
> > > the front is of the "closed C/G" type but the lever for the
> > > rear is of the older style. You can also see that there are
> > > differences in shape between the two levers. Actually, there
> > > are a couple of other differences that you will notice if you
> > > spend more time than is healthy examining the photo.
> >
> >
> >
> > I just took a look at the levers in question. First, the photo is
> out of
> > focus, so you can't really discern much detail. I took the pic
> into
> > Photoshop and did some contrast work to see if I could bring out
> any more
> > detail. (Not much) I tried to see what the lettering look like and
> I
> noticed
> > that both "C's" and "G's" look the same, closed. I took out two
> sets of
> > shifters I have, one from a ' 63 Cinelli and the other a newer
> set. The
> > older set has "closed" C's and G's and the word "Patent" is nearly
> the
> same
> > size as "Campagnolo" and the depression around the text comes very
> close
> to
> > the cable hole. On the newer set, the word "Patent" is much smaller
> than
> > "Campagnolo" and the recessed area around the text ends much
> farther away
> > from the holes as does the example on ebay. What this all means, I
> don't
> > have a clue, just an observation.
> >
> > David Goerndt
> > Orlando, FL
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 20
> > From: M4Campy@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 13:32:07 EDT
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Protecting new paint jobs
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > At the risk of beating this to death... What do people usually do
> about
> the
> > munging of paint at the dropouts? Live with it? Sand it down some?
> Touch
> it
> > up? Can you chrome
> > dropout faces after a frame has been painted? Costly.?.
> >
> > Mike "Short ride after yard work yesterday, ouch my back"
> Wilkinson
> >
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 21
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 13:37:03 -0400
> > From: Richard M Sachs <richardsachs@juno.com>
> > Subject: [CR]open<G> lever auction question
> >
> > as noted elsewhere, it does appear that these two
> > levers differ from each other and that perhaps the
> > entire assembly was concocted from parts.
> > i noticed another phenomenon: the amount of
> > little raised 'balls' around each lever's perimeter
> > differ. one has 45 and the other has 46.
> > can someone check this please.
> > thanks!
> > e-RICHIE
> > ...i'd be racing if i could ride today
> >
> >
> > link:
> > http://ebay.com/
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 22
> > From: "Douglas R. Brooks" <dbrk@troi.cc.rochester.edu>
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org (Classic Rendevous)
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:29:30 -0400 (EDT)
> > Subject: [CR]WTB: 26.6 post with setback
> >
> > Classicpals,
> > I'm looking for a 26.6 seatpost, preferably French and/or with a
> touch
> > of class, and with some darn setback. The Campy NR just doesn't
> let
> > you get the saddle back enough, though I may buy another as a
> spare
> > for the Singer.
> >
> > not a bad thing this fit I have but it could stand just a nudge
> > of tweaking, thanks, please drop me a line if you have a such a
> thing,
> > money or trade for cool stuff, either/mix is fine with me,
> > cold as Flanders here today,
> > Douglas Brooks
> > Canandaigua, NY
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > Message: 23
> > From: TGMetals98@aol.com
> > Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:55:23 EDT
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Now:Sexual Orientation Was:eBay item/campag item
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> > << Stevan Thomas wrote:
> > > I heard from Matteo in Italy that cyclo24 is a she. In an
> earlier
> email
> > > exchange that I had with cyclo, it was pretty obvious that
> he/she
> didn't
> > > understand the difference between a tubular and a clincher.
> >
> > <chuckschmidt@earthlink.net writes:
> > < Carsten Rehbein is a woman? Huh?!?!? >>
> >
> > Carsten is indeed a guy -- and a very nice one at that. Sometimes,
> his
> wife
> > Orchideen helps with the e-mails. Carsten is very knowledgeable,
> and I
> would
> > find it difficult to believe that he doesn't understand the
> difference
> > between a tublular and a clincher. It is perhaps, as Chuck
> suggested, a
> > language thing.
> >
> > Amanda Graham
> > Copake NY
> >
> >
> > --__--__--
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> >
> > End of Classicrendezvous Digest