Since one of my posts was included in your history of the last discussion on this, I thought I'd weigh in. I believe it was my inquiry that got this started last time as I was trying to decide whether to build wheels with high or low flange hubs. So here's what I can add: after purchasing a set of Campy HF 36 hole hubs I sent them with rims (Super Champion Gentleman) to Joe Young. Joe told me that 4X was possible with HF but not with LF because the spoke angle would cause overlap on the LF. He also said that a 4X build was only marginally stronger than 3X, with no real measurable advantage. My wheels are 3X build because Joe felt that trying to locate proper length spokes for potential future repairs might be difficult. Joe did tell me that what was most important to consider for my situation was achieving good flex in the wheel by using double butted spokes, because it was the flex that prevented breakage of spokes. This surprised me since I had been told by some (not on this list) that straight 15 ga. was the best for heavier riders.