I promised to forward these for Mr. Baylis earlier when we were down- If these appear again later it's just from previous tries:
Reforwarded messages (via Cutrufelli) for Mr. Baylis:
Yes, as a matter of fact there was some sort of rift between Masi and Cinelli in the early 70's. I can not speak for Colnago and their relationship, but there was a general knowledge amongst us who worked at Masi in the very early Carlsbad days that there was a reason why we were using 3ttt bars, stems, and saddles. The Everest chains and freewheels, and the Martano rims were also part of the situation. Ever see any other bike use Martano rims; I haven't. Only slightly before Masi, Carlsbad opened Masis were equipt with Regina and Cinelli. The Martano rims go back a ways further now that I think of it, and may not have been part of the "difference of opinion" between Masi and Cinelli. The initial shipments of components from Italy to Carlsbad lasted for a LONG time which is why almost all Carlsbad Masis have 1973 dated parts on them. By the time more were needed I think the fighting was over. I don't know if the disagreement was between the two companies or the two individuals. Nothing was ever openly discussed regarding this matter so we never knew any of the details (we being the fledglings at the time) but others may have known the nature of the original beef.
What isn't mentioned about the 3ttt bars and saddles that Masi used at the time is that a 3ttt saddle or bar will have the Masi "M" embossed on it. There were also a few "Faliero Masi" pantographed stems but those were not stock on all frames since there were a limited number of stems.
Hope that adds to the body of Masi knowledge.
Brian Baylis La Mesa, CA ...
Reforward from Mark Cutrufelli for Mr. Baylis:
-----Original Message----- From: Brian Baylis [mailto:rocklube@adnc.com] Sent: Saturday, June 15, 2002 1:35 AM To: rena.cutrufelli@comcast.net Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]Masi did not like Cinelli?
Mark,
For some reason my responces to these questions about tubing and parts used on CA and other Masis are not making it through to the list. I'm trying to figure out why right now. In the meantime, please forward my responce to the list if you would please.
I am aware of that letter but have not seen the original. There are a few things about it that I have always been curious about. For starters, Mario and the other Italian guy that came over with him Roberto, were here when I was hired in November 1973. One of the first things I remember was the "company dinner" Roland Sahm set out for us in the workshop in Carlsbad. Faliero, Mario, and Roberto all went home shortly after that for Christmas that year. I seem to remember that the 6 mo. visa was about to expire and that only Mario was to return, which he did. He was the only "essential employee" that was able to get an indeffinite visa to return and not be in violation of the laws that apply to such things. I'm assuming that Roberto could have probably done the same but parhaps not. Regardless, he didn't want to come back apparently on account of he had a ladyfriend in Italy and didn't want to stay here. Faliero had to wait the requisite time before he could return so he didn't come back until much later. Mario wanted to be here and stay here; which is obvious if one knows all of the things that indicate that. Not to mention that that is also how it happened. While Masi, Mario, and Roberto were here the first time they all lived in Roland Sahms' beachfront property in Del Mar, CA. They were given a vehicle to use, etc. If Mario recieved a letter from Colnago it would either have to have been sent to the address of Roland Sahms house or to the Masi factory on Avenida Encinas in Carlsbad; right under everyones' nose. Knowing these guys and what old world Italians are like, and also knowing how Faliero felt about Colnago; that all seems rather odd to me.
I'd like to see that letter in person just for grins. Anything is possible with these guys, but that letter has always struck me as odd; don't know why. I'm still curious Chuck. Any chance I can see the real deal in person? I've always been interested in seeing it since the very first time I became aware of it's existance.
I've got plans to talk to the second (American) Masi employee hired there to get a better feel for what was going on prior to any frames actually being built. Dates and events at that time are still a bit cloudy and I myself would at least like to know a bit more about the goings on prior to my arrival in Nov. 1973.
No doubt, we haven't heard the end of the Masi story yet; probably far from it. My sympathies to those who find these discussions objectionable.
Brian Baylis La Mesa, CA
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