Campagnolo Turismo Rear Derailleur
Has anyone seen or can send me some reference about a Campagnolo Turismo? It closely resembles the mid 1950's Gran Sport but instead of it reading GRAN SPORT it has the word TURISMO cast into the body. I have photos and any help would be appreciated.
Thanks Karl Edwards
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> CR
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Check Your Steel Campag Headsets Please! (swampmtn)
> 2. Re: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 5, Issue 76 (Dennis Young)
> 3. Regina singlespeed fw question (swampmtn)
> 4. Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> (Mara & Steven Maasland)
> 5. Fwd: Chris Beyer , A True gentleman
> 6. Re: Regina singlespeed fw question (Steve Neago)
> 7. Re: Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay (Steve Maas)
> 8. Re: Campy Catalogue
> 9. Re: Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay (bikenut)
> 10. Re: Re: Campy Catalogue
> 11. Re: victims of campy marketing
> 12. Northeast CR get together June 28th (Peter Naiman)
> 13. Re: Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay (Dave Van Hook)
> 14. Re: Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay (Dave Van Hook)
> 15. Re: NOS Value "Beaten to Death?" (Stephen Barner)
> 16. kids Bianchi on eBay Italia (Aldo Ross)
> 17. check your steel Campagnolo headsets please (Tom Dalton)
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:18:10 -0400
> From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Re: Check Your Steel Campag Headsets Please!
> Message-ID: <001201c320c9$2d21a1c0$d734fea9@mokry>
> References: <623CCA3D.250EC71A.0FD8938F@netscape.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Precedence: list
> Message: 1
>
> 1968 Paramount (frame built Nov.'67) - top and bottom hs say:
>
> "BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY"
>
> Aldo Ross
> Middletown, Ohio
>
> > David Bilenkey wrote:
> >
> > I asked this question a while ago but got no real answer so I thought I'd
> > ask folks a favour and see if something clearer comes of it.
> >
> > I'm working on a couple of project bikes and noticed some minor detail
> > differences. Both of them have chromed steel Campagnolo headsets, and they
> > are very similar but the one that's currently on the ~'65 Frejus says:
> > BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY on the top and bottom cups
> in
> > a slightly recessed groove around the circumference. Note the periods
> after
> > BREV.
> >
> > The one that's currently on the ~'72 Bevilacqua says (in a slightly
> recessed
> > groove around the circumference):
> > BREV CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV CAMPAGNOLO ITALY on the top and BREV CAMPAGNOLO
> > ITALY BREV CAMPAGNOLO <C> on the bottom cup.
> >
> > Notice the disappearance of the periods behind the BREV (both top and
> > bottom), the loss of one ITALY and the introduction of the <C> (on just
> the
> > bottom cup and I think on the bottom of the crown race but I haven't
> checked
> > that). Otherwise the headsets look identical (in shape).
> >
> > So my request; is could list members having bikes with their (believed)
> > original Campag steel headsets with similar writing on the cups, take a
> > moment to check these details and report what details they found (with the
> > year of the bike/headset)?
> >
> > I passed my original question on to John Barron and he reported a few
> things
> > including:
> >
> > > The next gen is what most everyone knows with words circumferentially in
> > > a recessed path, or wide groove. These started with a <C> on the lower
> > > cup (early 70's) and finished without.
> >
> > But I'm beginning to wonder if there were initially sets without the <C>
> but
> > with the period after BREV, and then the <C> was introduced and the period
> > got dropped (when is what I'd like to figure out), and then eventually we
> > had sets with neither the <C> nor the period. So I'm hoping the list might
> > be able to help uncover this bit of trivia. I'm of the opinion that this
> > headset I have on the '65 Frejus is correct and that this style of headset
> > dates from the early 60's.
> >
> > David Bilenkey
> > Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
> >
> > --
> > http://fineartscrimshaw.com
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________________________
> > Try AOL and get 1045 hours FREE for 45 days!
> > http://free.aol.com/
> >
> > Get AOL Instant Messenger 5.1 free of charge. Download Now!
> > http://aim.aol.com/
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 18:23:36 -0700
> From: Dennis Young <mail@woodworkingboy.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Re: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 5, Issue 76
> Message-ID: <BAF2C628.203F%mail@woodworkingboy.com>
> In-Reply-To: <CATFOODB52jK0AyTs8w000039f1@catfood.nt.phred.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Precedence: list
> Message: 2
>
> > "...Handling is not required to enjoy the beauty of the coins."
> >
> > i feel that way about my nos parts collection.
> > e-RICHIE
> > chester, ct
>
> I feel that way about Lou Deeter.
>
> Dennis Young
> Hohotaka, Japan
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:28:00 -0400
> From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Regina singlespeed fw question
> Message-ID: <000501c320ca$9d4da560$d734fea9@mokry>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Message: 3
>
> On the old Regina Extra single-speed freewheel - is the cog part of the
> outer body, or can you change the cog to a different size as on a multispeed
> fw?
>
> Aldo Ross
> Middletown, Ohio
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:12:45 -0400
> From: Mara & Steven Maasland <TheMaaslands@comcast.net>
> To: Classic Rendezvous <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> Message-ID: <87f3cd881f81.881f8187f3cd@icomcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
> Precedence: list
> Message: 4
>
> There is an interesting rather teutonic-looking model Peugeot for sale
> on German ebay. Does anybody want to guess what model.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/
>
> Steven Maasland
> Moorestown, NJ
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 22:44:05 EDT
> From: OROBOYZ@aol.com
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]Fwd: Chris Beyer , A True gentleman
> Message-ID: <124.221fe67b.2bfee4f5@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 5
>
> In a message dated 5/22/2003 10:23:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Diamondcaseco
> writes:
>
> << I first met Chris in the late 70's when he was working at an independent
> record store called Crazy Rhythms. Having problems with my Austin Mini, I was
> glad to find someone who understood them (Chris was then Vice President and
> head wine expert at the New Jersey Mini Preservation Society).
>
> Over the years, I found Chris to be one of the funniest, kindest,
> knowledgeable and complex people I had ever known. If he was in a room full of people,
> chances are that's where the most eclectic and interesting conversations were
> taking place.
>
> He was an avid music lover, wine connoisseur, gourmet chef, Mensa member, DJ
> on WFMU (check out http://wfmu.org/
> from last year), motor bike enthusiast (as his time at Ducati will attest),
> bicycle enthusiast, anglophile, francophile and much more I'm sure.
>
> Most importantly, he was devoted to his family, his Skye terriers and
> especially his wife April. Theirs was a bond lucky few have a chance to experience
> in a lifetime.
>
> I am honored to have gotten to know Chris and consider him a close friend.
> He affected so many people in a positive way and was taken from us so before
> his time. It's hard to believe he's really gone.
>
> For now I'd like to think he just beat me to the top of a long hill on his
> H.R. Morris and I'll just catch up to him one day.
>
> Martin Gold
> Montclair, NJ >>
>
> Dale Brown
> cycles de ORO, Inc.
> 1410 Mill Street
> Greensboro, North Carolina
> USA 27408
> 336-274-5959
> Fax 336-274-6360
> <A HREF="http://www.cyclesdeoro.com">cyclesdeORO.com</A>
> <A HREF="http://www.classicrendezvous.com/main.htm">Classic Rendezvous</A>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 23:23:55 -0400
> From: "Steve Neago" <questor@cinci.rr.com>
> To: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> Cc: classicrendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Regina singlespeed fw question
> Message-ID: <006c01c320da$befe44c0$cbb71b18@cinci.rr.com>
> References: <000501c320ca$9d4da560$d734fea9@mokry>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 6
>
> Hi Aldo,
>
> Is this the ebay auction you were seeking info?
>
> ITALIAN REGINA EXTRA SINGLE FREEWHEEL 22T NIB
> ebay Item # 2175099611 - Collectables:Transportation:Bicycle
>
> According to the Regina Extra Catalog C-78 on page 8, the freewheel body do
> not seem to allow swapping out cogs. I do not see how you could loosen the
> main cog because I think it is permanent.
>
> Regards, Steve Neago
> Cincinnati, OH
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:28 PM
> Subject: [CR]Regina singlespeed fw question
>
> > On the old Regina Extra single-speed freewheel - is the cog part of the
> > outer body, or can you change the cog to a different size as on a
> multispeed
> > fw?
> >
> > Aldo Ross
> > Middletown, Ohio
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 20:43:57 -0700
> From: Steve Maas <smaas@nonlintec.com>
> To: Classic Rendezvous <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> Message-ID: <3ECD98FD.20107@nonlintec.com>
> References: <87f3cd881f81.881f8187f3cd@icomcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 7
>
> Not sure of the model, but I think the size is about a 38. Frame
> seems to be in good shape, too.
>
> Steve Maas
> Long Beach, California
>
> Mara & Steven Maasland wrote:
>
> > There is an interesting rather teutonic-looking model Peugeot for sale
> > on German ebay. Does anybody want to guess what model.
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/
> >
> > Steven Maasland
> > Moorestown, NJ
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > .
> >
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:18:15 EDT
> From: BobHoveyGa@aol.com
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]Re: Campy Catalogue
> Message-ID: <1e0.9863d85.2bfefb07@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 8
>
> Is this a record for a Campy #14?
>
> <A HREF="http://ebay.com/<blah>
> campagnolo cataloge</A>
>
> Bob Hovey
> Columbus, GA
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 21:23:45 -0700
> From: "bikenut" <bikenut@gte.net>
> To: "Classic Rendezvous" <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> Message-ID: <000801c320e3$19f8b2e0$7d193c04@dslverizon.net>
> References: <87f3cd881f81.881f8187f3cd@icomcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 9
>
> Steven,
> That's the PX-10 DD Supercup Competition Model.
>
> Matt "Ich benötige dieses Fahrrad!!" Gorski
> Belmont Shore, CA
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Mara & Steven Maasland <TheMaaslands@comcast.net>
> To: Classic Rendezvous <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 7:12 PM
> Subject: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
>
> > There is an interesting rather teutonic-looking model Peugeot for sale
> > on German ebay. Does anybody want to guess what model.
> >
> > http://tinyurl.com/
> >
> > Steven Maasland
> > Moorestown, NJ
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 00:23:24 EDT
> From: ABikie@aol.com
> To: BobHoveyGa@aol.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR]Re: Campy Catalogue
> Message-ID: <174.1b59deda.2bfefc3c@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 10
>
> In a message dated 5/23/2003 12:19:06 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> BobHoveyGa@aol.com writes:
>
> >
> >
> > Is this a record for a Campy #14?
> >
> > <A HREF="http://ebay.com/<blah>
> > campagnolo cataloge</A>
> >
> > Bob Hovey
> > Columbus, GA
> >
> >
>
> Wow!
> I hope not and
> wonder what this much nicer one might bring?
> Larry black
> Mt airy, Md.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 06:23:25 EDT
> From: Wolfman231@aol.com
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR]victims of campy marketing
> Message-ID: <191.1a128dbd.2bff509d@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 11
>
> In a message dated 5/22/03 12:05:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
> tom@wilsonbike.com writes:
>
> << Is a bike that comes to a dealer from a manufacturer that is not the same
> spec as in their catalogue is not original then? This logic would tell me
> that factories do not produce factory original product. Maybe the catlogue
> had a typo, or the spec was changed to keep the cost down or because they
> ran out of the galli freewheel and they threw on an everest instead. This
> happened all the time. >>
>
> Hi Tom,
> First off, I'd love to have one of those galli freewheels for a galli
> project...were they gold anodized?
>
> To get back to your concerns about my original post in which I wrote:
> >If the catalog was printed, then a supplier went out of business, etc., and
> > none or few of that model year came equipped with that component, would a
> > sensible person argue that the bike MUST have that stated component to be
> > 'original?' Ummm...no.
>
> I should have been more specific than "etc.," but I was taking into account
> things like typos or minor spec changes. I must have underestimated the amount
> of spec changes going on, because I wouldn't have classified it as happening
> all the time. Sure, I remember the lower end models having generic,
> substituted parts. Take the seatpost for example: in one batch it was a Delta, the
> next it was a Strong, the next they slapped the house brand label on it. And
> often on those models the seatpost would be listed in the catalog as "alloy." I
> just don't remember the better bikes having that many major spec changes.
> Those are the bikes bought by the sophisticated customer who would notice
> deviations from the catalogs. But my bicycle industry exposure was limited to
> summers and afterschool at only two bike shops and 4 major brands (Schwinn,
> Panasonic, Peugeot and Specialized...oh...and only briefly, Cannondale) so I'll defer
> to the pros on the list and their experience in the industry. If they say it
> happened enough to be significant, OK. I'll be more mindful of that when
> restoring by catalog in the future.
>
> I'd say factories don't always produce factory 'original' product: sometimes
> when they run out of parts, they produce factory 'substituted' product. Let
> me give you a self-serving hypothetical: Motobecane runs short on derailleurs
> for their Jubilee model. They upspec to Campagnolo for a batch. For my
> thinking, that batch is an aberration, a substitution, but not the real Jubilee.
> Yes, it still says Jubilee on it...Motobecane calls it a Jubilee, but Motobecane
> didn't originally intend the Jubilee to have a Campagnolo derailleur. We
> literally define some models by the frame material and part spec: "Oh yeah, that
> was Brand X's SL Nuovo Record bike or Brand Z's Sante bike."
>
> You also asked:
> What about the bike shop's input? If a Paramount had a drivetrain that they
> knew from recent personal experience that the Everest freewheels did not
> mesh with the book spec D I D chain, and replaced it with the more
> functional and proper 'correct' Everest chain, does that mean the bike is
> now not orginal and out of correctness? If it was kept 'stock and correct'
> then the actual user would have a completely non functional bike. Better to
> sell a useless bike and be 'original' than a functional machine worthy of
> the $500.00 the budding racer spent on it? I think not.
> And the customer just might like his/her bike with a pump. Or the alloy toe
> clips found on the super record model instead of the stainless ones his
> Nuovo record model. Or the lighter tubes. This bike would not be original?
>
> My answer,
> No, I wouldn't call these cases original either. I never used the words
> correct or incorrect in any of my post. That would have been a value judgment. I
> just was defining what I thought was original. I would call the examples you
> cite as custom. Sometimes customizing improves a bike, sometimes it doesn't.
> Have you ever had a customer ask you to take a really nice lightweight
> racing bike and convert the drop bars to touring/flat bars? Would you consider
> this bike to be original? How about better, more functional? See the slippery
> slope once changes are made? Personally, I like to customize most of my bikes
> with my favorite saddles, pedals, etc. Even though thats how I may have set
> them up as new, they are still custom. That would be my same classification
> for a bare frame built up.
>
> Tom, thanks for taking the time to help me clarify my opinion. I'm sorry I
> didn't express myself better in the first post. I think we just have a
> different definition of the word original. And I hope I didn't get your boxers all
> in a bunch. ;-)
>
> Ed Kasper
> Detroit
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 7:23:44 -0400
> From: Peter Naiman <hetchins.pete@verizon.net>
> To: <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Northeast CR get together June 28th
> Message-ID: <20030523112344.PKCE4805.out003.verizon.net@localhost>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 12
>
> We have a date of Saturday June 28th for our CR get together at Larz Anderson. Plans are loose at this point, but we'll start early with a Ride around Boston famed Emerald Necklace greenspace, come back to the Museum, shmooz over our bikes etc and have a catered lunch or BBQ, and bring along parts to swap. This is not intended to be a show, just a get together of friends from the CR and other folks from the Northeast area who enjoy Lightweights. Our cost will be $150 to rent a portion of the grounds that day plus cost of a caterer. Cost will be $10.00 for the day, and any additional funds will go to a charity in memory of Chris Beyer. If your interested, please email to me so we can figure out roughly how many will attend that day. We hope to see many of our CR friends there.
> Regards, Peter
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 06:10:21 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Dave Van Hook <dvanhook@yahoo.com>
> To: Mara & Steven Maasland <TheMaaslands@comcast.net>
> Cc: Classic Rendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> Message-ID: <20030523131021.93195.qmail@web12306.mail.yahoo.com>
> In-Reply-To: <87f3cd881f81.881f8187f3cd@icomcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Precedence: list
> Message: 13
>
> This is unquestionably a 38C...models like this
> are still desirable for both show and function!
> I have no idea what the bike is!!!
> Dave
>
> =====
> Dave Van Hook
> Milton S. Hershey Medical Center
> Womens Health Center
> Dept of Radiology (Mammography)
> 670 Cherry Drive
> Hershey (yes, you can smell the chocolate) PA 17033
> Alternate email: dvanhook@psu.edu
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 06:21:18 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Dave Van Hook <dvanhook@yahoo.com>
> To: Mara & Steven Maasland <TheMaaslands@comcast.net>
> Cc: Classic Rendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Interesting Peugeot for sale on German Ebay
> Message-ID: <20030523132118.19068.qmail@web12304.mail.yahoo.com>
> In-Reply-To: <87f3cd881f81.881f8187f3cd@icomcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Message: 14
>
> Oh...I forgot to mention...I believe that if this
> model is NOS the final price may be set new
> record...and a bargain at that! If a list member
> is the winner, I want to be the first to request
> that this be brought to the Cirque next April!!
> Dave
>
> =====
> Dave Van Hook
> Milton S. Hershey Medical Center
> Womens Health Center
> Dept of Radiology (Mammography)
> 670 Cherry Drive
> Hershey (yes, you can smell the chocolate) PA 17033
> Alternate email: dvanhook@psu.edu
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
> http://search.yahoo.com
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:21:25 -0400
> From: "Stephen Barner" <steve@sburl.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Re: NOS Value "Beaten to Death?"
> Message-ID: <052001c3212e$368146c0$0e0111ac@loewy>
> References: <CATFOODB52jK0AyTs8w000039f1@catfood.nt.phred.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 15
>
> The logic of this argument totally escapes me. Coins are minted to be used
> in trade, but some people choose to hang on to them instead. Bikes and
> parts are manufactured to be ridden, but some people choose to hang on to
> them instead. In neither case is there any incentive for the manufacturer
> to make the product intending for it not to be used, unless it is created
> specifically for collection, in which case the cost is typically higher and
> there is a profit motive. I imagine truly rare coins are not manufactured
> that way, but are recognized as such later. The same appears to be true of
> most NOS bike stuff.
>
> The more I think of it, the more I have to believe that the desire to
> collect coins and keep them out of circulation and my desire to not use
> these NOS NR brake levers stem from the same character defect.
>
> Steve Barner, totally defective in Bolton, Vermont
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> > Date: Thu, 22 May 2003 15:19:44 -0500
> > From: "David Novoselsky" <dnovo@ix.netcom.com>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]Re: NOS Value "Beaten to Death?"
> > Message-ID: <002801c3209f$7c1c3c60$210110ac@VALUEDCB7D4C82>
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> > Message: 1
> >
> > As one who used to be heavily involved in another form of collecting, =
> > and having literally 'written the book' on at least one ascpect of the =
> > rare coin hobby (see the Pattern section of the "COIN WORLD ENCYCLOPEDIA =
> > OF AMERICAN COINS") may I sugggest that the anaolgy to uncirculated =
> > (actually, Mint State or Proof State) coins vs. NOS bikes falls down on =
> > one important point:
> >
> > Collecter coinage is meant to be carefully stored and maintained in =
> > as-new condition. Handling is not required to enjoy the beauty of the =
> > coins. Bikes however, at least for some of us, are meant to be ridden =
> > as part of their enjoyment is the way they respond to us as their =
> > riders. Of course, that is simply my opinion, and no more or less valid =
> > than that of any one else.
> >
> > Dave Novoselsky
> > Chicago, Illinois
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 09:30:59 -0400
> From: "Aldo Ross" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]kids Bianchi on eBay Italia
> Message-ID: <000801c3212f$a318d900$6cf9fea9@j4g1x1>
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> Message: 16
>
> Kid's Bianchi road bike on Italian eBay, listed as 1959 model:
>
> http://cgi.ebay.it/
> 9951
>
> Small Ambrosio tubular rims, Campy derailleurs.
>
> Aldo Ross
> Middletown, Ohio
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 07:11:14 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Tom Dalton <tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]check your steel Campagnolo headsets please
> Message-ID: <20030523141114.36264.qmail@web10907.mail.yahoo.com>
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> Message: 17
>
> David,
> This is going to be some challenging detective work. There are a couple of things to consider: 1) One or more of your headsets may be newer or older than the frame in which itís mounted (though if it is significantly newer it is probably not ëoriginal,í whatever that means) 2) Campy may have switched back-and-forth on some of the minute details, such as the periods, through time. One reason for this, as was pointed out to me by the esteemed Mr. Maasland, is that dies wear out, get switched around, etc.
>
>
>
> I never noticed the no-periods, one-period, two-period differences before. I will keep an eye out to try, over time, to make a ìstoryî out of this, but it may never happen. You mentioned a ìno-<C> no-periods lower cup as what you expect would be the last version. Is this just speculation, or have you seen one? If you havenít I there any good reason to think that the periods were removed at some late date. All my newer headsets have periods after each BREV.
>
>
>
> Here is what I think the story is: Overall the early headsets had the <C> and the later ones did not. There are also some differences in the crown races early on. I donít think that Campy would add the <C> and drop it again, but you never know. I think it is much more likely that the sequence was:
>
> BREV CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV CAMPAGNOLO <C> (your í72 Bevilacqua)
>
> BREV CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO <C> (Kurtís the ë70 Bartali)
>
> BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO <C> (I have a loose one like this)
>
> BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY BREV. CAMPAGNOLO ITALY (your í65 Frejus)
>
>
>
> Of course, this is completely at odds with the dates of the bikes, but one would only need to call on two conditions to resolve this.
>
>
>
> 1) The headset in the Frejus is not original, or the bike was originally assembled well after the vintage of the frameset.
>
> 2) The unit on the Bevilacqua was a couple years old when it was installed.
>
>
>
> The majority of the part-to-part differences that I see in NR and SR stuff are in the stamped-in logos and other markings. It is difficult to impossible to really nail down the sequences of variations to this level of detail, try as I do. It is even harder to put absolute dates on the changes. For my purposes, I figure early 70ís NR headsets have the <C> later ones do not.
>
>
>
> Tom Dalton
> Looking too hard in Bethlehem, PA
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> End of Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 5, Issue 77
> ************************************************