Excerpting John's explanation:
> The hiccup here is the VERY early box that Pergolizzi has that
> is a yellowed white with blue letters. For all we know, a distributor
> had boxes made up for the Campy parts they sold... There's also the
> green Campy HS box on HI Campy's site...
I have seen John's box and have had my own share of older boxes too. I am completely convinced that John's box was previously a color other than white and has simply faded (my best guess is that it was blue on blue.) I sold a box with Cambio Corsa bits to Japan about 6 months ago and it was dark blue on some sides and completely white on others. The difference was undoubtedly exposure to sunlight. As for Hitoshi's box, this was a track headset, so I believe the green color was to differentiate between track and road.
Personally, I think that the following comment from John is extremely important:
> My best and only reference is from what I have, and have seen, and while
> I've seen a lot, there's others who have seen more, or at least have
> seen different stuff. We need to rely on faith a bit that the correct
> parts were in the correct box...
This same comment should also be used for virtually everything that was produced before the 60's as modifications were quite frequent and more than likely never documented. There is no one single 'fact' but rather many possible and logical explanations of what can be determined to be likely 'facts'. This reminds me about an aggressive accusation that was leveled at me offlist by a listmember recently. He accused me of misrepresenting an item that was sold to him (incidentally not by me). He then went on to suggest a full annulment of the deal or partial rebate was needed, close to 7 months after the transaction had taken place. Even though I was not the seller, I offered him a full refund of the $3K he had paid for the 1950's Campagnolo parts, as he had called my
good name into question. Although the proffered refund was precisely what had been requested by him, he turned down the offer. It would seem that he thought that he had come across a simple way to pressure a goodfaith seller into giving a post-deal discount. It is a pity that there are such people next to such honorable people like John, Scott, Matteo, etc... who, while selling parts are also willing to share their accumulated experience free of charge to all those who want to learn more. Maybe a new award for le cirque could be the 'most honorable' seller.
-- Steven Maasland Moorestown, NJ ---------------------- Forwarded Message: --------------------- From: Chuck Schmidt <chuckschmidt@earthlink.net> To: themaaslands@comcast.net Subject: Was [CR]Campagnolo box timeline NOW honorable sellers Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2003 20:42:27 -0700
Excerpting John's explanation:
> The hiccup here is the VERY early box that Pergolizzi has that
> is a yellowed white with blue letters. For all we know, a distributor
> had boxes made up for the Campy parts they sold... There's also the
> green Campy HS box on HI Campy's site...
I have seen John's box and have had my own share of older boxes too. I am completely convinced that John's box was previously a color other than white and has simply faded (my best guess is that it was blue on blue.) I sold a box with Cambio Corsa bits to Japan about 6 months ago and it was dark blue on some sides and completely white on others. The difference was undoubtedly exposure to sunlight. As for Hitoshi's box, this was a track headset, so I believe the green color was to differentiate between track and road.
Personally, I think that the following comment from John is extremely important:
> My best and only reference is from what I have, and have seen, and while
> I've seen a lot, there's others who have seen more, or at least have
> seen different stuff. We need to rely on faith a bit that the correct
> parts were in the correct box...
This same comment should also be used for virtually everything that was produced before the 60's as modifications were quite frequent and more than likely never documented. There is no one single 'fact' but rather many possible and logical explanations of what can be determined to be likely 'facts'. This reminds me about an aggressive accusation that was leveled at me offlist by a listmember recently. He accused me of misrepresenting an item that was sold to him (incidentally not by me). He then went on to suggest a full annulment of the deal or partial rebate was needed, close to 7 months after the transaction had taken place. Even though I was not the seller, I offered him a full refund of the $3K he had paid for the 1950's Campagnolo parts, as he had called my
good name into question. Although the proffered refund was precisely what had been requested by him, he turned down the offer. It would seem that he thought that he had come across a simple way to pressure a goodfaith seller into giving a post-deal discount. It is a pity that there are such people next to such honorable people like John, Scott, Matteo, etc... who, while selling parts are also willing to share their accumulated experience free of charge to all those who want to learn more. Maybe a new award for le cirque could be the 'most honorable' seller.
--
Steven Maasland
Moorestown, NJ