-----Original Message----- From: Mike Schmidt <mdschmidt@patmedia.net> Sent: Dec 30, 2004 2:24 PM To: chasds@mindspring.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]gios for sale
Having seen the bike, 2500 is not reasonable but 1800 is. It actually has never been ridden Mike Schmidt Stirling, NJ
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See here's the thing (if this proves boring, just delete me. I find this stuff quite interesting, especially since I've paid WAY more than I should have for all kinds of stuff, and especially when I was still fairly green at all this. If I can save even one person a few hundred bucks by clearing up a nuance or two, that'd make me happy.)....here's the thing:
Even at 1800 bucks, that bike is tough to justify. Mostly because for that kind of money there are a LOT of interesting bikes one could buy, bikes that come around every now and then...I bet if I offered list-members 1800 bucks cash for an interesting bike, a lot of offers would come my way, and for bikes FAR more interesting/charming than that Gios.
So, you could do a lot better with that kind of money, and you could end up with a bike that would hold its value much better, ridden or unridden. More on that below.
The worst part, from where I sit, the premium is nearly all in the NOS quality of it. Ride it? It's now worth half what you paid, if that. Worse than buying a new American sedan <g>.
So, it retains its value (maybe) only if it remains unridden. That means only someone with a real emotional attachment to it should buy it, because they'd have no problem keeping it as a wall-hanger (you wanna ride it? solution: find another one that's used, and ride that...I am ashamed to say that I have a few pairs of bikes of that sort).
And if you don't mind losing a grand when you ride it, then this discussion is meaningless, I agree.
But, I suspect most of us would wince at losing a grand...so I assume that's a relevant point in all this.
Let's take the bike itself. Wrong color (you think Gios, you think Gios blue, no getting around that); it's an 80s bike. With 80s parts. By then Gios was just another more-or-less anonymous italian marque, right? Not like in the early 70s when it came in a suitcase with the cranks and stuff, displayed like a museum piece....or in the mid-70s, when de Vlaeminck made the marque famous. And, it's not a prime size.
I just can't see how it's worth any more than a grand. But I'd surely like to hear counterarguments, because the subject interests me.
One final example: For $1800 I can, in due time, find myself a nice Cinelli SC frame and fork. Clean, used, original. Silver.. Chrome is good. Let's say frame and fork cost me $1500. That's not unreasonable these days, assuming I don't have to out-bid some nut-case for it. <g> 56cm c-t, so it's a prime size. Now I spend 300 or 400 bucks for all the correct parts, clean and used. I assemble the bike. I put some nice tires on it. I have about 2K in it. In two years it'll be worth more than I paid. Heck, it's probably worth more than I paid the minute I finish building it. And I can ride it, because there's no NOS premium. I'd rather have that hypothetical Cinelli than that Gios any day, for both personal, and practical reasons. I expect most of us would say the same. Hence my comment about the Gios.
And that Cinelli is not really hypothetical; most of us have built numerous nice bikes just like this, and congratulated ourselves on our frugality..and good taste..<g>
Charles *too many very real projects and not enough time* Andrews SoCal
> Ray wrote:
>
> NOS-Full Campagnolo SR Gios Torino 53cm center to center white leather
> stitched bars fluted cranks non dated rear derailleur, never road and
> never even glued on the tires. 2500.00
>
> ******
>
> Just my opinion, but the seller is dreamin'. And,
> of course, he's entitled to dream on all he wants.
>
> I just hope no-one actually *pays* that much for it.
>
> Awhile ago I had a chance to buy the much earlier
> Gios with all the panto'd bits, from the early 70s..
> I shoulda bought it, but at $1200, I just couldn't get
> excited about it.
>
> That white one is less desirable, imho. If it fetched
> 800 bucks on ebay, I'd be surprised.
>
> What do you guys think?
>
> Charles "cynic" Andrews
> SoCal