Re: [CR]PY-10 is not PX-10

(Example: Framebuilders)

Date: Fri, 22 Jul 2005 09:56:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [CR]PY-10 is not PX-10
To: Verizon <smwillis@verizon.net>, "Feeken, Dirk" <dirk.feeken@sap.com>, Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
In-Reply-To: <001b01c58eda$be930cd0$2f01a8c0@t1s9z1>


Presumably the PY-12 was the 12-speed update of the 10-speed PY-10. I guess that would imply that the "10" in PX-10 stood for 10 speeds. I was never so sure about that, and the UO-8 was a 10-speed in the early 70's. By 1986, near the end of the Peugeots that we would consider "classic", they had evidently given up that methodology. In the catalog that came with my 1986 PZ(-10) (still lugged 531), the two top steel model were designated simply "PZ" and "PX".

Regards,

Jerry Moos

Verizon <smwillis@verizon.net> wrote: That is how I remember it too and my old boss had a PY-12 add that to the mix. Steven Steven Willis 1778 East Second Street Scotch Plains NJ 07076 908-322-3330 http://www.thebikestand.com


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jerome & Elizabeth Moos"
To: "Feeken, Dirk"
Sent: Thursday, July 21, 2005 11:42 AM
Subject: Re: [CR]PY-10 is not PX-10



>I think there may be a difference in terminology here and perhaps a
>difference it model designation between between Peugeots sold in the US and
>those sold in Europe. I'm pretty sure that around 1975 Peugeot began
>selling in the US a model designated PY-10. This was updated versus
>previous PX-10 specs, with no fender eyelets, Maillard small-flange hubs
>replacing Large-flange Normandy Competition, Simplex SLJ with Retrofriction
>shifters replacing Criterium, and engraved bars and allen head stems
>replacing the older AVA. Of course, the PX-10 (or its variants) soon
>evolved in that direction, but I think these components first appeared on
>the bike sold as PY-10 in USA. I believe there was in the US catalog a
>custom-order version designated PY-10CP or something like that, but the
>PY-10 itself was not a custom order. It did not have the MAFAC brazeons
>found on team bikes. In Europe, perhaps the PY-10 was a custom order
>version only, equivalent to the US PY-10CP, and perhaps the the
> nearest equivalent to the US production PY-10 was called PX-10 or some
> variant like PX-10LE in Europe. I believe there may have been significant
> differences between US and European specs, partly because I have a
> mid-70's bike originally sold in Germany, on which the frame looks like
> the US PY-10, but much of the equipment is different. One difference is
> the "superlight" Mafac CP's (plastic lever bodies with no hoods, calipers
> more like Weinmann than classic Mafac). I don't ever remember seeing
> these brakes as standard equipment on any Peugeot sold in the US. I've
> been calling this bike a PY-10, but I don't really know what model name it
> was originally sold under.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
>
> "Feeken, Dirk" wrote:
>>PY-10 and PX-10s are an integral part of cycling
>>history. They brought high-performance to the masses.
>
>>It is naïve to expect a PY-10 to be as well crafted as
>>a Baylis, since almost no bikes at that time were toiled
>>over like a Baylis is today, and certainly not a
>>moderately priced production racing bike.
>
> Just to put it strait: The PY-10 was not a moderately priced production
> bike for the masses. Don't confuse it with the PX-10.
> While the PX-10 was a (very good) mass product the PY-10 was built
> individually for each customer in Peugeots special tiny "Prestige" Shop
> where also the team bikes have been built. The made to measure PY-10 was
> almost three times more expensive than the PX-10. According to "The
> Custom Bicycle" a lot of work went into each frame, but more on the
> design and planning part than in the actual build process.
> If anybody has expected a craftmenship of the frame comparable to a
> Colnago Super or Raleigh Team Pro, he might have been disappointed.
> Nevertheless the bike is very cool and I like the "overall look" more
> than that of the Raleigh.
>
> Dirk

>

> --

> Dirk Feeken

> Heidelberg

> Germany