On Aug 10, 2005, at 5:05 PM, Jon3084@aol.com wrote:
> Sachs (6)
> Baylis (4)
> Kvale (2)
> Nagasawa(2)
> and one each of
> Goodrich,Landshark,Bates,Caygil,Weigle,Hampsten,Strawberry,Kendria,Het
> chens,TiCycles,Mercian,Zaconato.Pegoretti.
How exactly is Ti Cycles a KOF? I like Dave and all, but he and the lads build a large majority tig welded titanium frames. Or Pegoretti for that matter? Does one lugged frame in a line-up make it KOF. If so is De Rosa even though they make the King along with the Primato? And Hampsten too. . . do they even build any of their own frames, or are they contract built by someone else?
This leads me to something I've been meaning to say for a long time. KOF is a bunch of hooey. If you really wanted a KOF frame you would use brass only and standard tube diameters for starters. Lugs do not a "classic" bike make folks. Heck I build what most folks call KOF frames and would love the business that having Keeper Of The Flame attached to my frames would bring, but instead my motto is "Modern Frames, Traditional Techniques" I'll have none of this KOF bull puckey. If the list really is about bikes built before 1984 lets keep the bikes within that time line.
Ok, so if people insist on using this silly title KOF for builders today lets set some base rules. Try these on for size: 1. Lugs do not make it KOF. There were many other joining methods back in the day. 2. Steel doesn't make it KOF. We've already decided that early Kleins, Teledyles, Grafteks, ETC are list worthy. 3. The old builders didn't use oversized tubes, except in rare cases like with some of the French bikes and tandems. 4. Files were used for mitering tubes. The small bike builders of yore didn't use huge mills or much serious tooling for doing their miters or building. 5. blah, blah, blah. . . I could go on but really think people who out there really builds bikes the way they did in the old days. I know a few, but only a few that still build that way.
The frames people revere from the past are quite different from the frames made today and that should be what makes them special. There are many builders building today, but they're not building the same way or the same frames and that to should be OK too. I think we should get back to what this list is about classic lightweight bicycles built before 1984. If you want to talk about cool lugged steel frames built after 1984 that should be a separate list.
Thanks for letting me rant,
Brandon"monkeyman"Ives
Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
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"Sine coffea nihil sum."
--Sarah Vowell--
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