RE: [CR]Dating Brooks saddles - new aspect

(Example: Production Builders:LeJeune)

In-Reply-To: <007c01c6c22c$cfbda660$09717ad5@com>
From: "neil foddering" <neilfoddering@hotmail.com>
To: ndland@btinternet.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: RE: [CR]Dating Brooks saddles - new aspect
Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 22:16:07 +0000


Nigel,

Iwas born in 1950, so I'm afraid I have no first-hand knowledge of brass shortages - I'm deferring to Norman on this point, who appears to have done some research - so you may well be right. However, a Google search I've just carried out does seem to support there having been a brass shortage during the brief period in question.

As far as a wonder alloy is concerned, aluminium alloy cycle components were certainly available from the mid-late 30's onwards. The 1937-8 Tabucchi catalogue, for example, lists hubs, Lyotard pedals, handlebars, stems, mudguards, sprint rims, Mavic wired-on rims, drinking bottles, bottle holders and brakes in aluminium, and the 1939 Brown Brothers catalogue lists these items plus chainsets and seatposts, plus, probably, items I've overlooked.

Also, the Holdsworth alloy badges appear to have been used only for a brief period. The brass Holdsworth badge was, I believe used before the war, and then again, by 1947, with the aluminium one as (I assume) a temporary stopgap. This, I suggest, may well also have been the case with the Brooks badges.

Best regards,

Neil Foddering Weymouth, Dorset, England


>From: "NIGEL LAND" <ndland@btinternet.com>
>Reply-To: "NIGEL LAND" <ndland@btinternet.com>
>To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
>CC: <neilfoddering@hotmail.com>>
>Subject: [CR]Dating Brooks saddles - new aspect
>Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 19:41:43 +0100
>
>Neil, I like your theory and I do remember the almost universal use of
>aluminium for cooking pans in the late 1940s, but surely brass would have
>also been more available as it was not being used for shell cases much post
>1945. Aluminium was being widely used for aircraft during the war and I
>would guess that it was in demand postwar for thes ame purpose, as
>passenger
>flights once more became possible. It is a very interesting theory, but we
>need more evidence - aluminium was considered a wonder alloy in the 40s and
>50s wasn't it? Perhaps alloy badges was just technical progress?
>
>Nigel Land
>Barton on Humber
>UK
>
>
>Date: Thu, 17 Aug 2006 11:19:50 +0000
>From: "neil foddering" <neilfoddering@hotmail.com>
>To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
>Subject: [CR]Dating Brooks saddles - new aspect
>Message-ID: <BAY115-F8542D52ECADD8622B7FAFBF4D0@phx.gbl>
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>
>
>I have a pet theory, which I'm willing to have shot down, that Brooks
>saddles with aluminium badges (see right hand saddle at
>http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v396/hadendowa/Brooks%20badges/ with
>brass
>badged 1930's Sprinter for comparison) date to just after WW2. The saddle
>with the aluminium badge is a B17 Narrow with oval badge stamping in the
>leather. I have another Brooks saddle, a 4-wire model with an oval badge
>in
>the leather (but no model designation) and an aluminium badge at the rear.
>
>The reason for this wild stab in the dark is that my 1946 Holdsworth, in
>its
>original finish, has an aluminium alloy headbadge, of the pattern which was
>produced in brass by 1947. In discussion with Norman Kilgariff (see
>http://homepage.ntlworld.com/nkilgariff/ ,click on the "HISTORY" button,
>scroll down, and click on "Aluminium Headbadges") we surmised that this was
>due to the brass shortage in England shortly after WW2. This could also
>have been the case with Brooks.
>
>I'd welcome comments.
>
>Neil Foddering
>Weymouth, Dorset, England