Jerry wrote:
"Well, PayPal's policy and that of most credit card companies is that the seller is responsible for lost shipments. "
This is not true. Both require that the seller have irrefutable proof that the item was delivered according to the sales conditions. If the seller clearly states that the delivery is the responsability of the purchaser and can demonstrate that the goods were in fact delivered to the delivery agent, neither Paypal nor the cerdit card companies will ever side with the purchaser. Unfortunately this virtually means that the seller must pay for tracing.
Jerry goes on to state: "That's the main reason I am suspicious of eBay setters that don't take PayPal. That said there is still some grey area here."
I don't see any grey area whatsoever. I prefer not to accept paypal and state as much to all buyers in my invoices. The first reason is for the costs involved, the second is due the fact that I once had a fellow make an unwarranted claim against me. Notwithstanding that I immediately supplied all the necessary details to the paypal dispute resolution team, it took close to a month before I had access to my money. At the same time, all further incoming payments were also blocked. BTW, the fellow, who I believe to now be a former CR-listmember, continued to claim that the item never was delivered, but an identical, very rare item newly showed up "by miracle" on one of his bikes shortly after Paypal turned down his refund request. The buyer did not however ever admit to having received it.
Jerry in another post also recalls a transaction where he had decided to not pay extra for expedited shipment of an item from Germany. He made a claim against the seller through paypal at a point in time where normal delivery was not even assured according to the standard delivery timing given by the German postal authority. The claim was made at that time because he was afraid that the allowable time period for claims through Paypal was about to pass. He not only unfairly got Paypal to refund his payment, he also badmouthed the seller on this forum. Then, surprise surprise, the item arrived (within the foreseen time as per the German postal authority website) and Jerry made an apology about the unwarranted disparagement, but the damage had already been done to the reputation of the seller and the seller was also forced to suffer the same problems that I described in my own Paypal dispute case above. Jerry claims to have made good on the payment to the seller, but what about all the other accessory costs that he incurred to the seller?
In my ebay blocked bidder list, there are three categories of people who are included: 1) the deadbeats who bid but don't pay, 2) the people who abuse sellers in general (there is one purveyor of vintage bike parts whose own feedback record remains private, hence immune from verification both of feedback received as well as feedback left for others, who just happens to be the sole person to ever give a negative feedback to numerous 'competing' vintage bike component suppliers) and 3) those who are simply not worth the hassle to deal with. This last case includes those I feel to have acted unfairly or dishonorably and unfortunately includes a number of CR listmembers.
Steven Maasland
Moorestown, NJ
USA