RE: [CR]Ted's takes or touches on torching torques

(Example: Framebuilding:Paint)

From: "Ken Freeman" <freesound@comcast.net>
To: "'ternst'" <ternst1@cox.net>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
Subject: RE: [CR]Ted's takes or touches on torching torques
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 06:41:04 -0500
In-Reply-To: <008601c701db$0c5bb1f0$0300a8c0@D8XCLL51>
Thread-Index: AccB2wxZHd+h5Yu7TZyPFDOD1z1kfQAhjB1Q


Ted, thanks for the perspective! I thnk some at least of my breakages have been due to weakened parts. Also a big "duhh I never t'ought o' dat" with wearing bike mitts with those Italian thin-bladed instruments!

Ken Freeman Ann Arbor, MI USA

-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of ternst Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 2:38 PM To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Ted's takes or touches on torching torques

Do I recall correctly that the torque specs came in with CPSC and all the lawsuits that came about because of the mass migration of bike proliferation into the discount, etc. so called bike selling commodity brokerages doing naughty assembly? If I remember it seems that quite a few bike shops also got hammered in this hysteria. Ergo, torqued with a "T". I agree that most of the oldtime and newtime crackerjack mechanics don't need or want the "TW's because they have the touch and feel to know when the tightness and tension are proper without deforming or over stressing the product, and the load specs are made on dry not lubed threads. That still doesn't save any of us from unknown defects or flaws in the material being worked on. As to torque values for hub, head, pedal, bottom bracket tightness, etc., I submit the following. The hub spoke load was a good point, to which I add the need to consider how tight you make the quick release or outside fastening. I was always taught that to be very accurate ( I think it's called anal) when adjusting cones and locknuts, to always turn the cone down against the thread so the tightening of the locknut doesn't over compress the cone into the thread making the adjustment trickier. This is a practiced touch and finesse. For hubs you'll need a bench vise, axle vise, among your oher vices. Axle vise sounds like edelweiss, so move over Julie, because to most of us a well tuned bike is the sound of music. Our own resident music and bike expert, Charles Andrews, can attest to that. Of course, when in the field if a vise is not handy, then taking two cone wrenches or two open ends to get the desired play is what all mechanics do when in a hurry. So much for the master's lessons. Wear a pair of fingerless cycling gloves so you don't damage your palms / tendons with thin edged instrumenti. (Italian for tools, in case you were unaware of what the proper name is). The bottom bracket is tricky as the cup is pulled out when the locknut is tightened. It takes an experienced touch to set the spindle so you can tighten the cup and locknut simultaneously and end up with the desired adjustment. Also, many mechanics say to turn the axle / spindle by turning the entire wrist then rocking it for play. Supposed to be a better feel than just turning the part with finger twist. After all is pontificated upon, it boils down to having as little play as possible to the feel and no binding or tight spots when everything is tightened down or up as the case may be. OK, sideways to you, too. But then again, when playing with the the oulder not so precise stuff it gets so that one has to know when good enough is perfect because that's as good as it's gonna get. Like the old venerable track rider said,"Everythings got to be tightened just a little loose."
Ted Ernst
Palos Verdes Estates
CA USA