Well, Harvey, in three succinct words, you just told the KoF builders how they should do business. They should engender *trust*, enter into a *partnership* with the customer and provide *value*. Not a bad business model, but nothing for which you as the customer can assume responsibility. All of what you want has to come from the provider, not the consumer.
The builders are competing for our - the non-builders - money. Your requirements are - and should be - the bare minimum needed to get our interest. The builder is offering a product on which he hopes to entice me to spend my money. To do that, he needs to convince me I can trust him to do a good job, that his product will meet both my needs and requests (including a timely delivery), and that it will provide me value for my investment - however I might define that. The burden on me as a consumer is to be reasonable and not a demanding a$$hole and pay promptly for that which I order.
For the record I have a KoF SS/fixie from Jonny Cycles, another if you are willing to define Irio Tommasini as a KoF builder, and my wife's Andy Gilmour, though in fairness I bought that one from the original owner and not as a custom order from Andy himself.
Harvey M Sachs wrote:
> Brethren and Sistern -
> I'd wonder if the conversation about how "they" (KOF builders)
> "should" do business has gone too far. I feel blessed to know some of
> the gentlemen who've been named, and have known a number over the
> years. It is striking that none of them has asked my about how to do
> business better (although some bike shops have, even though I am not
> in the bicycle business).
>
> Instead, let's turn the lens around, since we're about 1500 members,
> of whom I doubt 50 are in business as builders. Probably a lot more of
> us are or want to be experts in one thing: What do we want from a
> framebuilder before we offer our patronage, before we commit our funds
> to him for some uncertain time before the transaction is completed?
> We're in the midst of a house extension, which involves the same kinds
> of issues as selecting a KOF framebuilder, and I think the analogies
> may be helpful. Thinking hard, here's what matters to me:
>
> TRUST is the most important thing for me. Trust that the framebuilder
> or contractor will deliver a quality product that meets expectations.
> Brings joy, satisfaction, delight, as well as the tangibles on the
> order sheet or contract.
>
> PARTNERSHIP. I don't want to feel that I am just bringing money to the
> table. I need to feel that the builder listens to what I need for my
> kind of riding, to what I want (ride, appearance), and will build a
> bike that helps me feel better about riding. I trust that he (or she)
> won't give me something stupid, even if I ask for it, but will explain
> why my "wants" were not good. I'm curious enough to want to know what
> tubing and angles & such he's chosen, but darned sure not gonna tell
> him which to use (I don't think I have the right to select both
> materials/specifications and outcome, since the former may affect the
> latter).
>
> VALUE. By far the greatest part is the sense of satisfaction I get
> after a ride that I can only describe as "Wow! the bike just
> disappeared. It was so good that I didn't have to think about it." In
> another context, Steve Maasland refered to this as smiles and
> chuckles. A bit is also a shameful reflection of fear that some
> pretentious ignorant slob will dump on my choice.
> So, to me getting a KOF bike is partly about process. There are some
> builders who are the masters of this; one says he's in the personal
> services business more than the bike business. More like an
> orthodontist than a Chevy dealer, I guess. If I'm at all typical,
> then builders who disdain personal contact but want to increase
> business may have to find passionate "sponsors" to get out the word. I
> think of what I believe to have been Dale's role in representing,
> explaining, and marketing McLean's beautiful work, so McLean could
> work with minimum distraction and interruption. But, there are many
> other ways to make that happen, as has been suggested on the list.
>
> But, maybe my preferences are irrelevant: I only have one KOF (a
> Peter Weigle that I love), and must 'fess up that it was not
> custom-fitted for me, but Peter's own bike that I bought "as is." It
> just fits and rides as if it were made for what I think I want. If I
> were really a frame builder, I'd want to hear from those who are more
> actively in the market.
>
> My hope is that those who are thinking seriously about getting a KOF
> would be willing to share how they will select a builder.
>
--
Phil Sieg
Knoxville, Tennessee