If you noticed...I was pretty precise in my wording...
In roughly a two year period we sold about a dozen in the 850 - 3000 model range...each and every one cracked. THAT IS STATISTICALLY VERY SIGNIFICANT.
The same problem was reported elsewhere with the few other dealers nation-wide.
If you visit bikeforums.net...folks from outside California have posted pictures and/or their experiences...
Literally by 87/88 - Benotto pretty much dropped off the planet United States wise...they never recovered here...
What is left now via that website in Mexico is literally a shell of its former self...
And yes...the Modelo was also produced in Mexico - not just Italy.
As to the Modelo 3500...I haven't been able to confirm that it went the same route...
=8-)
Quoting Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>:
> Well, this contradicts some information that only low/mid models were made in
> Mexico. The Benotto 3000 was definitely high end. Would the team bikes in
> "A Sunday in Hell" have been model 3000, presumably Italian-made ones? Never
> know what to make of statements about certain models breaking. Usually, the
> actual failure rate is very low and the so-called problem models, although
> they may have a significantly higher failure rate than others, still have
> very few failures in absolute terms. I know some people will not buy a used
> classic aluminum frame like ALAN or Vitus, due to concerns about fatigue
> failure. But I've ridden these for years and never had a problem or
> personally known anyone who did. It's really a matter of statistics, I
> suppose. Plus some heavy and powerful riders with a gear-mashing riding
> style can break almost anything, while smaller riders who spin never break
> anything.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Big Spring, TX
>
>
>
> mrrabbit@mrrabbit.net wrote:
> I've posted this info before on bikeforums.net, but I'll do the same
> here...
>
> I used to work in a shop that sold Benottos...
>
> Far as I know production replication started in the late seventies in Mexico
>
> and by 80, 81, or 82 a range of models were moved to Mexico for the the South
>
> and North American markets. About this time models came in general with
> two "made in" labels.
> Production quality never matched that of those still made in Italy for
> European
>
> sales.
>
> Anyhow, those made in Mexico and sent to the U.S. for distribution cracked.
>
> Modelo 800 (Hi-Ten) DID NOT CRACK
> Modelo 850 (Zeta) Cracked where seatube entered bb shell lug.
> Modelo 1000 (Zeta/Aelle) Cracked where seatube entered bb shell lug.
> Modelo 1500 (Aelle) Cracked where seatube entered bb shell lug.
> Modelo 2000 (Ishiwata 019) Cracked where seatube entered bb shell lug.
> Modelos Track Models with Zeta/Aelle Cracked where seatube entered bb shell
> lug.
> Modelo 3000 (SL) Cracked where seatube entered bb shell lug.
>
> Modelo 3000 were made in both Mexico and Italy. Modelo 3500 (SLX) were
> supposedly only made in Italy. Modelo 5000SL (Gilco / MS) were made only in
> Italy.
>
> There was a rumor around 86 / 87 that the Modelo 3500 (SLX) production was
> also
>
> duplicated in Mexico...and that they were plaqued by downtube separation from
>
> the headtube.
>
> George Slough here in San Jose once had a Modelo 3500 (SLX) in his Race
> Street
> shop that was affected by this...however when I looked at it - didn't see
> a "Made In" label.
>
> The problems noted above continued all the way into the mid-80's. Benotto
> made
>
> an effort like Peugeot to update the models with Shimano 105 and 600ex
> gruppos
> with aero levers - but they kept using the same base frames as listed above -
>
> and those failed too...
>
> Too little too late...by 87, most dealers nation-wide had literally dumped
> Benotto.
>
> Dale Saso here in San Jose provided a guesstimate having looked at a couple.
>
> His guess was that the brazers had overheated the lugs and tubes making them
>
> prematurely "brittle"...some failed within a matter of months...some took a
> year to fail. The Modelo 800 made with Hi-Ten steel apparently could
> withstand
>
> some abuse and therefore they tend to survive intact to this day - lots of
> pop
> up on eBay.
>
> Benotto is one of my all-time favorite brands. Every one of their road
> models,
>
> even the lowly Modelo 800 had racing geometry. Change a few parts and it was
> a
>
> decent bike. I myself had a black and silver 1986/87 Modelo 2000 (Ishiwata
> 019) with a mix of Ofmega, Campy and Suntour. It literally both broke my
> heart
>
> and pissed me off when it cracked. I still miss this bike.
>
> We sold about a dozen bikes in the 850 to 3000 range - each and every one
> came
> back cracked...most belonging to high school buddies.
>
> As to Benottos on eBay...here's something that's really pissing me off over
> the
>
> last 4-5 years. I'm noticing that too many sellers are being very dishonest
> when selling mid-80's in the same range noted above.
>
> They'll provide great angle shots of the bike, closeups of the headtube, the
>
> rear triangle...BUT NOT THE SEATUBE!!!
>
> I'll email them asking, "Where was it made? Please provided a closeup of the
>
> seatube..."
>
> They'll flat out ignore me - one dude emailed me back saying, "Fuck off!"
> Should have saved that email...literally...just those two words...nothing
> else.
>
> If it is made in Mexico...it'll have a decal on the seatube noting exactly
> that. I'm also noticing that a lot of these same sellers seem to have removed
>
> the "Modelo" label which is always alongside the toptube near the headtube on
>
> both sides of the bike.
>
> So when shopping on eBay - if they don't answer your question or show the
> necessary close-up - move on...don't take the risk unless all you want is a
> showcase bike.
>
> If you happen to come across a mid-80's Modelo 5000SL in red or blue with the
>
> Gilco / MS tubing - well I envy you. That was an absolutely beautiful bike.
>
>
> Robert Shackelford
> Wheels By Fleming
> http://www.mrrabbit.net
> mrrabbit@mrrabbit.net
>
>
>
> Quoting greg piwonka
> :
>
> >
> > i've seen a bike that was from the 80's that was a top model 3000 or 3500
> c
> > an't remember exactly that had a made in italy sticker on it.
> > also i have a modelo 3000 from the 80's sometime that has no made in
> mexico
> > or made in italy sticker and no heart shaped cutout in the bottom bracket
> > shell.
> > benotto's history is confusing.
> > i read somehwere that the reason benotto moved production to mexico was to
>
> > be close to a lady friend...a love affair...probably false...who knows you
>
> > can read all kinds of crazy things on the internet.
> > greg piwonka
> > austin tx
> >
> > > Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 08:58:13 -0500
> > > From: veronaman@gmail.com
> > > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > > Subject: [CR]Benotto, Mexico, The Impossible Hour
> > >
> > > Steven Maasland previously posted this in June 2003:
> > > "Benotto has a web site at http://www.benotto.com.mx it doesn't say anything
> > > about their history, but I have an Italian book that describes how they
> > > started in Turin in 1931. One of the family members moved to Mexico
> > > City in the 70's and production was started up there. From the
> > > information that I have seen their top bikes were still built in Italy
> > > for a few years after the start-up in Mexico. Once the quality was at
> > > least as good in Mexico as it was in Italy, they moved all production
> > > to Mexico. They sponsored pro teams almost continuously from the 40's
> > > onwards and therefore are probably one of the most long-standing pro
> > > bike suppliers."
> > >
> > > Angel Garcia
> > > Verona, IT
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Along the same lines, I was watching last night the opening scene of A
> > > Sunday In Hell, which shows a team mechanic preping a champagne color
> > > Benotto for Moser or one of his teammates. The bike is all Campy, but th
> > ere
> > > is not a clear view of the RD. It looks to be either an NR or a 1st
> > > generation SR. Does anyone know which? A Sunday In Hell is, I believe,
> > the
> > > 1976 edition of Paris-Roubaix. Would the Benotto team bikes in that year
> > > have been made in Italy or Mexico?
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > >
> > > Jerry Moos
> > > Big Spring, TX
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > devotion finesse wrote:
> > >
> > > I am watching Jorgen Leth's film "The Impossible Hour", which documents
> D
> > an
> > > ish racer Ole Ritter's 1974 attempts to regain the hour record from
> Merck
> > x
> > > in 1974.
> > > Ritter (and his teammate/training partner/future hour record holder
> Franc
> > es
> > > co Moser) are shown training in Mexico City in Benotto team kits and
> ridi
> > ng
> > > on Benotto bikes.
> > > I am wondering what year Benotto relocated from Italy to Mexico, and
> whet
> > he
> > > r or not there is any connection to the time spent training there in
> prep
> > ar
> > > ation for The Hour.
> > > Did Ritter ride Benotto bikes because they were local? Or did Senor
> Benot
> > to
> > > fall in love with Mexico while his team was training there? Or are these
>
> > t
> > > hings completely unrelated?
> > > At any point, was there Benotto production in both Italy or Mexico? Or
> wa
> > s
> > > the entire company "relocated" all at once?
> > > I always assumed that the Mexican Benottos were simply outsourced. Was
> th
> > i
> > > s not the case?
> > >
> > > Matthew Bowne
> > > Again, trying to connect the dots in...
> > > Brooklyn, New York
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > _______________________________________________
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we g
> > ive.
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> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> >
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