[CR]re; pre 1983 carbon tubed frames

Example: Production Builders:Peugeot:PY-10

Date: Fri, 30 May 2008 17:08:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: westown@earthlink.net
To: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]re; pre 1983 carbon tubed frames

Our esteemed colleague in Streator IL has a point. Like the Exxon Graftek frames, early carbon suffered catastrophic failures, thus his plastic bike comment. My brother had a failed Graftek hanging in his shop, snapped like a twig. It is written that the Exxon Graftek was the first carbon-tubed metal lugged frame. Reference, William Hudson. They did however come out before 1983 Langley's site says 1975.

Chris Plunkett Chicago, Illinois USA

Date: Fri, 30 May 2008 11:58:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net> To: Eric Burns <theej@mchsi.com>, ktk1_7_0_2_8@yahoo.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]KOF ALAN FANINI TEAM BIKE PHOTOS posted to Wool Jersey Message-ID: <854814.30773.qm@web82204.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <484022F0.6050009@mchsi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Message: 9

I woudn't be so quick to judge this. To start with, if a lightweight bike was built in 1983 or before, it is On Topic regardless of the material of construction. This includes Graftek, Teledyne, Speedwell, and Vitus and ALAN aluminium frames, not to mention French aluminum frames from the 50's and even some from before WWII.

The Garftek frames were I believe only laminated with carbon. And it thought the Vitus and ALAN "carbon" framesets were carbon laminations over aluminum tubes, rather than completely carbon tubes - unless someone can correct me on this. In any case "disposable plastic bike" seems a little strong for this ALAN. I have a 1981, and therefore On Topic, ALAN Super Record which from 20 feet looks almost identical to this bike, although mine is not in fact carbon tubes, only black anodized aluminum ones. Now it may be that the Carbonio version of the ALAN was introduced after 1983, and in fact the components on this one seem to be late 80's or early 90's. But I wouldn't lay money that the Carbonio didn't just squeek in before the CR cutoff.

If the Carbonio version was indeed introduced after 1983, then it would be for Dale to rule whether it is sufficiently different from the On Topic all-aluminum Super Record to render the Carbonio Off Topic. If the tubes are indeed all carbon, there might be a good case that it is indeed Off Topic, but if it is just a Super Record with some carbon fibre overlaid on the main tubes, a case could be made that it is just a later variation of an On Topic bike. Of course Dale can rule however he wishes, even if he chooses to be totally arbitrary - his list after alll.

Jerry Moos
Big Spring, Texas, USA