[CR]Fillet-Braze Schwinns - the Saga Continues

(Example: Framebuilders:Alex Singer)

Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:00:21 -0400
From: <apw55@adelphia.net>
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]Fillet-Braze Schwinns - the Saga Continues
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The history of the early fillet-brazed Schwinns is murky at best. I don't have a New World but in researching late '40's vintage Continentals learned quite a bit about them. I found the two best sources of information to be the Schwinn Forum and Tom Findley's website.

If you go to http://www.schwinnbike.com, click on the "Heritage" tab and then sele ct the "Collectors Forum", you're there. You don't have to be a member to do a search so anyone can go in and check the archives for threads about th e New World, Superior or Continental. Of course, the Superior and Continen tal names were re-used so some of these threads are about the later models. I started a thread titled "1940's Continental" when I began my research a nd it grew to contain quite a lot of information and pictures of early Schw inn Lightweights.

Tom Findley's website, http://www.trfindley.com has a collection of early Schwinn Catalogs and pricelists which I found valuable in trying to figure out when various models were produced.

A brief history of the early fillet-brazed Schwinn Lightweights as I unders tand it is as follows: the Superior and New World were introduced in 1938, the Superior being the more exepnsive and slotting in just below the Param ount on the price and quality scale. Both featured fillet-brazed CroMo fra mes with rearward (track style) dropouts. I am unaware that there were any significant differences in quality or geometry. Components would have acc ounted for the price differential. The standard configuration was that of a typical "English" bicycle of that period with an upright seating position but a wide variey of optional equipment was available including lever oper ated drum or caliper brakes, Maes or Moustache bars, etc., etc. Both came with 26" wheels which were designated as 1.375" wide and had a bead seat di ameter of 599mm, not to be confused with post-war Schwinn wheels which were designated as 26" x 1 3/8" and had a 597mm bead seat diameter. Unlike lat er Schwinn lightweights, many of the components; hubs, brake calipers and t he like were made in house.

Following the Second World War, the Continental took over as the top of the line fillet-brazed lightweight (still 2nd to the Paramount overall). Func tionally, the Continental was pretty similar to the Superior but the subdue d colors, graphics and pin striping were replaced with flashy decals, stain less steel fenders and "flamboyant" colors. The 1954 pricelist shows the C ontinental as being discontinued that year.

The New World was produced following the war and continued to be the lower priced lightweight. The Superior still showed up on pricelists in between the New World and the Continental. Oddly, the Superior is not mentioned in any of the postwar catalogs that I've seen which leads me to speculate tha t perhaps Schwinn still had an inventory of pre-war frames on hand. The Ne w World seems to have been replaced by the electro-forged "World" model by 1950 and the Superior disappeared from the pricelists by 1953.

I have three late '40's Continentals (pictures appear in various Schwinn Fo rum threads) in varying degrees of originality. The first was quite incomp lete so I built it up Clubman style with an FW hub, 590mm rims, Bluemels, d rops and a B17, all of which were a bit more recent than the 1940's. I rid e this bike more than anything else I own. The third seems to be nearly al l original (except tires and brake pads) including fabric coated cable casi ngs but I still need to rebuild the wheels and make some other adjustments before I ride it very much. The second one is in between in terms of compl eteness and worst cosmetically. I will most likely sell it this summer.

If anyone has any additional information or literature about these early Sc hwinn lightweights, I'd love to hear about it.

Regards, Alan Weeks Lake Placid, NY


> Date: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 20:17:04 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]Fillet-Braze Schwinns - the Saga Continues
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>
> For those list members twisted enough to actually care about the Schwinn fillet-brazed models, I completed my collection of these models today with the receipt of a 1972 Super Sport to go with the 1973 Sports Tourer and the
   1962 all-chrome Superior. Well, almost completed. According to the Sheld on Brown's article on these bikes, the original models were the Superior an d the New World in 1938. But even Sheldon didn't have much information on the New World, and did not say how long it was produced. Anyone on the lis t have a New World? I'd love to see pics or info.
>
> Rather interesting that although I paid $179 for the complete bike and was the only bidder, it was extraordinarily well packed. I've received bik es three times the price, hell six times the price, that were not half as c arefully packed. Absolutely complete, everything was there, even to the ex tent that after arriving home at 6:30 PM, I was able to unpack it, assemble
   it, and ride it around the block before dark. I've seldom been able to do
   that with a $1,000+ bike.
>
> So to compare the Super Sport to the Sports Tourer, they seem to have i dentical fillet-brazed CroMo frames except the the Super Sport has stamped DO's albeit thick ones, whereas the Sports Tourer has forged Huret DO's. T he Huret DO has an integrated RD hanger, while the Super Sport stamped DO d oes not, requiring a separate hanger. Both bikes have similar Huret Allvit
   FD's, assuming the Allvit model applied to FD's, but the Super Sport has H uret Allvit front and rear, while the RD on the Sports Tourer is a Schwinn badged Shimano Crane GS, same as on the World Voyageur and mid-70's touring
   Paramounts. The Sports Tourer has DiaCompe CP calipers and levers, includ ing suicide levers. The Super Sport has the same except the levers are Wei nmann, rather than its very good DiaCompe clones. Not sure if the Schwinn Approved calipers are Weinmann or DiaCompe. Same "S" stem and unmarked all oy randonneur bars on both. The Sports Tourer has a TA Cyclotourist double,
   while the
> Super Sport has the venerable Ashtabula cranks. My 1962 Superior, a hig her end model than either, also has Ashtabula cranks, but that was a decade
   earlier, plus the Superior has Huret rings. Pedals are Lyotard (or maybe Atom) rattraps on both. The Super Sport has Schwinn-approved AFA toeclips.
>
> As I speculated before I received it, the Schwinn-approved hubs on the Super Sport are Normandy Sport, while those on the Sports Tourer are Normad y Competition. Examining the original wheels on the 1962 Superior, they do
   not match either, but I'm pretty sure they are Normandy. Somehow, they lo ok like top models, so I'm guessing they are early Competition or whatever top model preceded the Competition. Both bikes use Weinmann Alloy 27" clin chers.
>
> One dilemma is what to do about shifters. Both have the Schwinn stem s hifters, but the catalogs indicate the Suntour barcons were optional on eac h. I've pretty well decied to go with the SunTours on the Sports Tourer, b ut I imagine the Super Sport would only rarely have been sold with barcons,
   so I'm considering keeping the stem shifters. Opinions?
>
> BTW, on a somewhat related matter, I've found the fillet-brazed Chicago -built Schwinns have low bottom brackets which make them unsuitable for 650 B conversions, while my Japanese-built World Voyageur has a high BB, which made for a great 650B conversion. What about the Japanese-built Voyageur 1 1.8? Did it have a high BB like the World Voyageur?
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Big Spring, Texas, USA