[CR]RE: Travel with a bike

(Example: Framebuilders:Pino Morroni)

From: Dan Rogers <drogers@modernmind.com>
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
References: <MONKEYFOODTkUD5euwd0000041d@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 08:57:44 -0700
Thread-Index: Acjh1iwmopwWsarpQNi3aB6pRxRMygABTHYg
In-Reply-To:
Subject: [CR]RE: Travel with a bike


Brent et al - to your question on travel logistics and costs for taking a bike on the plane - it is even more ugly and expensive than in the past. I am leaving today from Seattle to Denver to ride the Negri in the Triple Bypass. For background, I should be able to get some sort of break - I am a 1K million miler on United and am flying them today. Basically the deal is - no deals! You get one box - rigidly measured at 62 inches (several airlines are 60.5" for some reason) H+L+W including "bulges" (i.e., measured at the fattest part) and assuming you go over that measure - the charges and oversize surcharges kick-in. Even hard travel cases are treated the same way. If you get a friendly agent you may be able to slip it by, but I have not had any luck with that. The regular bags are up to $40, a bike is $75, and with the surcharges it can go as high as $110 each way - yikes.

I have had some luck with 2 boxes - wheels, fork and accessories and the second for the frame only. With deflated 700c tires I have been able to get both boxes in under 62", but this is hard with quill stem bikes.

My new, reluctant solution is that I am ordering a steel Ritchie Breakaway frame and building it specifically to travel to the 4-6 events I do each year. Not vintage, not even KOF, but also checked as "normal baggage"!

Best of luck.

Dan Rogers Bainbridge Island, WA

-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2008 8:11 AM To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 67, Issue 32

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CR

Today's Topics:

1. identify this bike! (John Stehlin) 2. AW: [CR]FS NOS Fiamme red label, old logo track rims, 36h black label time span (Schmid) 3. Talk about timing! Wayne's post about Cirque judging (Tom Sanders) 4. Overseas Travel With Bicycle (Michael Thompson) 5. : [CR]Fillet-Braze Schwinns - the Saga Continues (Harvey Sachs) 6. KOF Cyclops for sale posting (Steven Sweedler) 7. Re: Overseas Travel With Bicycle (Brent Harrell) 8. Re: Talk about timing! Wayne's post about Cirque judging (Edward Albert) 9. Re: FS NOS Fiamme red label, old logo track rims, 36h (George Allen) 10. re:Flying with your bike (as opposed to 'flying on your bike') (Bob Freitas) 11. Re: re:Flying with your bike (as opposed to 'flying on your bike') (Mikey Schmidt)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:33:31 -0400 From: "John Stehlin" <jgstehlin@gmail.com> To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]identify this bike! Message-ID: <61ef9b610807082033q1f67e71v82952390088a837e@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 1

Hello all, I recently obtained a cool path racer as a frameset with very little to go on about its origin, and I'd like to know more. UK made that much I can tell, and it had only a floating-race headset and one Bayliss-Wiley bb cup when first purchased. Had only ugly brown primer so this is my cheapo rattlecan paintjob. Picasa web album located here:

http://picasaweb.google.com/jgstehlin/UntitledAlbum

I tried to take pictures of features of the frame and fork only so it would be easier to ignore the more bogus aspects of the build (Wald bars and '80s Campag track cranks?), because I would like all you of greater brain than I (everyone) to help me identify this frameset. In case the serial number under the bb is unreadable in the pic, it's 61 64 D22 E38. In the first two digit gaps there appears a degree symbol looking thing, and in the last gap a small "2", much smaller than the other digits. Nervex bb shell and Campag fork tips. Any and all help appreciated.

Thanks! John Stehlin Philadelphia, PA USA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 09:01:51 +0200 From: "Schmid" <schmidi@gaponline.de> To: "'KO Kevin'" <kko@ci.springfield.or.us>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: AW: [CR]FS NOS Fiamme red label, old logo track rims, 36h black label time span Message-ID: <001e01c8e191$a99a5330$fe78a8c0@Twinhead> In-Reply-To: <4E5ACC97F0E9F44AA1AE70E250AE5B81B7AF8F@spifs005.Springfield1.net> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 2

I have to jump on that train for a different question. Speaking of Rigida red label rims, does anybody know the timeline for the old black label tubular Pro rims? I have two pair of these and was thinking about lacing up a set of wheels for my mid fifties Cinelli B. Would the pro rim be in production then already or were they introduced later?

Thanks for the input.

Regards

Michael Schmid Oberammergau Germany Tel.: +49 8821 798790 Fax.:+49 8821 798791 mail: schmid@zunterer.com http://www.zunterer.com

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] Im Auftrag von KO Kevin Gesendet: Dienstag, 8. Juli 2008 19:09 An: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Betreff: RE: [CR]FS NOS Fiamme red label, old logo track rims, 36h

Without seeing your rims I can't be certain, but Fiamme was noted for the angled sidewalls on their tubular rims which were used for both road and track. I have had Fiamme red label and yellow label rims with angled sidewalls that were originally laced to road hubs. And yes, they were very narrow and also low profile. Fiamme used angled sidewalls as recently as the late 70's with their Ergal "Hard Silver" rims. These were my favorite road racing rims back in the day. My favorite track rims were the ultra-light Super Champion Medal D'Or.

Kevin Ko Eugene, OR USA

_______________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 05:50:59 -0400 From: "Tom Sanders" <tesanders@comcast.net> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: [CR]Talk about timing! Wayne's post about Cirque judging Message-ID: <001101c8e1a9$4bb9ce90$e32d6bb0$@net> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 3

Here it is 5:30 in the morning. I woke up thinking that I'd write Wayne about this very subject and when I turn on my computer, I see that he has just posted on the very issues I wanted to cover in a post to him. It seems more appropriate now to post to the list instead.

I love the original and period perfect bikes I see at Cirque. I do feel that the focus has become excessively narrowed on them, however. Imagine a car show where all the entrees are just the way they rolled off the assembly line. There are such shows.they hold my interest for a little while and then I start thinking "Where are the Hot Rods? The Roadsters? The Customs?". It seems to myself and to some others that the emphasis has taken a turn away from any sort of individuality on the part of the folks restoring and creating bikes as hot rods or expressions of their own individuality. This is fine. It will work on a limited basis. We can make it a Concourse d' Elegance if we wish. Do we really wish to? I sure as heck do not.

Where would be the room for bikes like that fantastic Hetchins with the 19th Century handlebars that won People's choice a few years ago? How about John Barron's breath taking Red Paramount with the stunning drillium additions of two years ago? Or even that ghastly but very interesting Ostrich Skin covered Colnago from this year? Do we really want to relegate bikes like these to some kind of second class status? Remember when we make our tent a lot smaller, a lot less bikes and folks fit beneath it.

For me, every year the Cirque event becomes more and more about the people there than the bikes. The bikes are just wonderful, but the chance to hang out with friends I mostly only see once a year is even better. Lots of these friends have an individual idea of what they want their bikes to be. If they want absolutely original or even unrestored absolutely original that is fine with me.but there is variation in the bike owner's vision of their bikes and this variation is every bit as important as any other aspect of bike collecting, in my opinion. We need room for these varying visions of bicycle excellence and we need to do it without relegating a major (and to me most interesting) portion of folks bringing bikes to a second class status. The idea of folks declaring their bikes as one thing or another sounds good at first but the more I look at it, the more it smacks of a 1950s Loyalty Oath.

I think we either need to judge the bikes as to how nice they are or to quit any but a People's Choice Award.

Celebrate diversity.

Tom Sanders

Lansing, Mi USA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 02:52:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Michael Thompson <meauxtown@yahoo.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Overseas Travel With Bicycle Message-ID: <378648.19937.qm@web63414.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Reply-To: meauxtown@yahoo.com Message: 4

I am thinking of taking my bicycle to the Continent for a 2 week tour in Oc tober. It has been some years since I've been out of the country with my bi ke and I'm sure things have changed. Does anyone know what the airlines  now charge for oversize/heavy bags? What can I expect at the counter? Thanks.

Michael Thompson Monroe, Louisiana

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 06:14:59 -0400 From: Harvey Sachs <hmsachs@verizon.net> To: apw55@adelphia.net, Classic Rendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Harvey Sachs <hmsachs@verizon.net> Subject: : [CR]Fillet-Braze Schwinns - the Saga Continues Message-ID: <48748FA3.1050206@verizon.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Reply-To: hsachs@alumni.rice.edu Message: 5

Thank you, Alan, for the really helpful post. I can add just a couple of

"factoids" that might be helpful to some. In particular, Schwinn seems to have been very careful about model differentiation at the top end. The cranks and hubs of the early Superiors and the early Paramounts look

very similar, but have some small, frustrating, differences.

CRANKS: conventional 9/16" pedal threading on the Paramount, but 1/2" on

the Superior (at least on Larry Black's bike, which I think was a Superior, but perhaps a Continental?). HUBS: Again, the parts look very similar. But, the Paramount uses the conventional 1.370x24 sprocket threading, with what is very close to Italian locknut. The Superior I played with used different, non-interchangeable sprocket threading, but I can't remember what it was. The axles are different, too. The Paramount uses a weird system. The cones slide freely, but with very close tolerance, onto a ground axle, and are located by a pair of locknuts on each side. This was advertised as a "vacuum fit," as I recall. The axles were countersunk at

the ends, and thin in the middle (not a good idea). I fess up: my own '38 P'mount has a superior axle set in front. This was a conventional system with threaded cones and a single lock nut on each side.

I would speculate that Paramount buyers paid a very stiff premium that justified these differences, and try to put my head into the late Depression period, when labor to run machine tools would have been rather inexpensive. Pure speculation.

thanks again, Alan.

harvey sachs mcLean va usa

+++++++++++++++++ Alan Weeks wrote:

The history of the early fillet-brazed Schwinns is murky at best. I don't have a New World but in researching late '40's vintage Continentals learned quite a bit about them. I found the two best sources of information to be the Schwinn Forum and Tom Findley's website.

If you go to http://www.schwinnbike.com, click on the "Heritage" tab and then sele ct the "Collectors Forum", you're there. You don't have to be a member to do a search so anyone can go in and check the archives for threads about th e New World, Superior or Continental. Of course, the Superior and Continen tal names were re-used so some of these threads are about the later models. I started a thread titled "1940's Continental" when I began my research a nd it grew to contain quite a lot of information and pictures of early Schw inn Lightweights.

Tom Findley's website, http://www.trfindley.com has a collection of early Schwinn Catalogs and pricelists which I found valuable in trying to figure out when various models were produced.

A brief history of the early fillet-brazed Schwinn Lightweights as I unders tand it is as follows: the Superior and New World were introduced in 1938, the Superior being the more exepnsive and slotting in just below the Param ount on the price and quality scale. Both featured fillet-brazed CroMo fra mes with rearward (track style) dropouts. I am unaware that there were any significant differences in quality or geometry. Components would have acc ounted for the price differential. The standard configuration was that of a typical "English" bicycle of that period with an upright seating position but a wide variey of optional equipment was available including lever oper ated drum or caliper brakes, Maes or Moustache bars, etc., etc. Both came with 26" wheels which were designated as 1.375" wide and had a bead seat di ameter of 599mm, not to be confused with post-war Schwinn wheels which were designated as 26" x 1 3/8" and had a 597mm bead seat diameter. Unlike lat er Schwinn lightweights, many of the components; hubs, brake calipers and t he like were made in house.

Following the Second World War, the Continental took over as the top of the line fillet-brazed lightweight (still 2nd to the Paramount overall). Func tionally, the Continental was pretty similar to the Superior but the subdue d colors, graphics and pin striping were replaced with flashy decals, stain less steel fenders and "flamboyant" colors. The 1954 pricelist shows the C ontinental as being discontinued that year.

The New World was produced following the war and continued to be the lower priced lightweight. The Superior still showed up on pricelists in between the New World and the Continental. Oddly, the Superior is not mentioned in any of the postwar catalogs that I've seen which leads me to speculate tha t perhaps Schwinn still had an inventory of pre-war frames on hand. The Ne w World seems to have been replaced by the electro-forged "World" model by 1950 and the Superior disappeared from the pricelists by 1953.

I have three late '40's Continentals (pictures appear in various Schwinn Fo rum threads) in varying degrees of originality. The first was quite incomp lete so I built it up Clubman style with an FW hub, 590mm rims, Bluemels, d rops and a B17, all of which were a bit more recent than the 1940's. I rid e this bike more than anything else I own. The third seems to be nearly al l original (except tires and brake pads) including fabric coated cable casi ngs but I still need to rebuild the wheels and make some other adjustments before I ride it very much. The second one is in between in terms of compl eteness and worst cosmetically. I will most likely sell it this summer.

If anyone has any additional information or literature about these early Sc hwinn lightweights, I'd love to hear about it.

Regards, Alan Weeks Lake Placid, NY ------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 07:32:17 -0400 From: "Steven Sweedler" <sweedler@gmail.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]KOF Cyclops for sale posting Message-ID: <28aa41ea0807090432i45be8cc9w864e50abc5ba691c@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 6

I have for sale a 1988 Cyclops road bike custom built by Mike Mulholland of Ontario, Canada. He died in the last few years. It is 60 c-c seat tube and 57.5 top tube c-c. The head tube angle is 75, the seat tube angle is 73. The tubes are Columbus SL with a SP seat tube. Bottom Bracket height is 27.5. It is in original paint in poor shape, a new set of decals is included. The builder described it as a Euro style road frame. The frame is exceptional, the components are not and are out of our timeline .

Front wheel: Mavic hub, 32 h, laced to a Open 4 CD Conti Grand Prix 3000 700 x 28 Rear Wheel: Mavic hub 32 h, MA 2[new label] Conti Sport 1000 700 x 25 Freewheel is a 7 speed Sachs 12-28 Crankset: Shimano 600, 175 52-39 Rear der: Shimano 600 Front der: Dura Ace early model Handlebars: Modolo Equipe 42 c-c Shifters: 7 speed Shimano Bar ends Stem: Dimension 110 mm ext. Seat post SR Sakae 27.2 x 225 Saddle: Broks B 17 N black like new Brakes Shimano Exage Motion calipers, Shimano 600 levers Price is $400 shipping at cost, can deliver to Larz This is a great riding frame that I hope finds an appreciative home. It was a custom build for a local rider that made it as far as the national 'B' team Pictures are here http://community.webshots.com/album/564045863oNxHVY Steve Sweedler Plymouth, New Hampshire ------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 08:16:14 -0400 From: "Brent Harrell" <brent.harrell@gmail.com> To: meauxtown@yahoo.com Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]Overseas Travel With Bicycle Message-ID: <9ed736a0807090516j13a60a8fy2358b7731a6f102c@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <378648.19937.qm@web63414.mail.re1.yahoo.com> References: <378648.19937.qm@web63414.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7

Michael,

The last time I took a normal sized bike box, it was $100 each way. You may have to take it to the oversize bag check area. They may open the box if the xray machine won't fit it. I felt lucky to be there when they opened and was able to remotely coach how to repack. If they open and you're not around, they're supposed to put a flyer in the box telling you they opened/searched.

If you have a choice on bikes, you might want to take one you don't mind getting a scratch on. Keeps the stress level lower.

Good luck, Brent Harrell Orlando, FL

On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 05:52, Michael Thompson <meauxtown@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I am thinking of taking my bicycle to the Continent for a 2 week tour in Oc
> tober. It has been some years since I've been out of the country with my bi
> ke and I'm sure things have changed. Does anyone know what the airlines
> now charge for oversize/heavy bags? What can I expect at the counter?
> Thanks.
>
> Michael Thompson
> Monroe, Louisiana


>
> _______________________________________________
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 08:21:11 -0400 From: "Edward Albert" <Edward.H.Albert@hofstra.edu> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, <tesanders@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [CR]Talk about timing! Wayne's post about Cirque judging Message-ID: <s8747518.068@gw15.hofstra.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 8

Tom, Let me begin with the statement that, overall, I agree with you. How 's that for a disclaimer for what is to come :). You say "Celebrate diversity." Well, just what does that mean. In its original political context it does not really refer to a "do you own thing" approach but rather the idea that each culture has a character that is as viable and as valuable as any other and can only be judged by its own standards. Politically, whether I agree with that or not is not a discussion for this list and I will leave it there. However, I believe our use of the term IS appropriate to the process of judging bikes. In an attempt to make this post as short as possible your post suggests more not less categories. Each as valuable, in its own right, but each judged by its own criteria. Bikes claiming to be original and, minimally period correct, should be judged in light of their claim. Bikes claiming to be an expression of an individuals creativity and quirkiness should be judged accordingly -- perhaps leaving that up to the judges complete discression as to what they like. This years judging had the Charlie Brown award. It was, admittedly, sort of a joke (sorry Harvey) but the Alenax won hands down. Such categories could be regularized in a "serious" way and one could enter a bike that you believed was an expression of your won "creativity." Like the lizard skin colnago. Also, not my cup of campy grease but cool by its own standards. In short, there is room for a big tent while still preserving what we have come to call, sometimes disparagingly, a concours d'elegance where faithfulness to the original, rarity, historical importance, etc. become all important. Edward Albert Chappaqua, New York, U.S.A.
>>> "Tom Sanders" <tesanders@comcast.net> 07/09/08 5:50 AM >>> Here it is 5:30 in the morning. I woke up thinking that I'd write Wayne about this very subject and when I turn on my computer, I see that he has just posted on the very issues I wanted to cover in a post to him. It seems more appropriate now to post to the list instead.

I love the original and period perfect bikes I see at Cirque. I do feel that the focus has become excessively narrowed on them, however. Imagine a car show where all the entrees are just the way they rolled off the assembly line. There are such shows.they hold my interest for a little while and then I start thinking "Where are the Hot Rods? The Roadsters? The Customs?". It seems to myself and to some others that the emphasis has taken a turn away from any sort of individuality on the part of the folks restoring and creating bikes as hot rods or expressions of their own individuality. This is fine. It will work on a limited basis. We can make it a Concourse d' Elegance if we wish. Do we really wish to? I sure as heck do not.

Where would be the room for bikes like that fantastic Hetchins with the 19th Century handlebars that won People's choice a few years ago? How about John Barron's breath taking Red Paramount with the stunning drillium additions of two years ago? Or even that ghastly but very interesting Ostrich Skin covered Colnago from this year? Do we really want to relegate bikes like these to some kind of second class status? Remember when we make our tent a lot smaller, a lot less bikes and folks fit beneath it.

For me, every year the Cirque event becomes more and more about the people there than the bikes. The bikes are just wonderful, but the chance to hang out with friends I mostly only see once a year is even better. Lots of these friends have an individual idea of what they want their bikes to be. If they want absolutely original or even unrestored absolutely original that is fine with me.but there is variation in the bike owner's vision of their bikes and this variation is every bit as important as any other aspect of bike collecting, in my opinion. We need room for these varying visions of bicycle excellence and we need to do it without relegating a major (and to me most interesting) portion of folks bringing bikes to a second class status. The idea of folks declaring their bikes as one thing or another sounds good at first but the more I look at it, the more it smacks of a 1950s Loyalty Oath.

I think we either need to judge the bikes as to how nice they are or to quit any but a People's Choice Award.

Celebrate diversity.

Tom Sanders

Lansing, Mi USA

_______________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 10:03:36 -0400 From: George Allen <jgallen@lexairinc.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]FS NOS Fiamme red label, old logo track rims, 36h Message-ID: <4874C538.4060307@lexairinc.com> In-Reply-To: <4E5ACC97F0E9F44AA1AE70E250AE5B81B7AF8F@spifs005.Springfield1.net> References: <4E5ACC97F0E9F44AA1AE70E250AE5B81B7AF8F@spifs005.Springfield1.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 9

You can check out the following websites concerning Fiamme rim catalogs of the period. The rims I have measure 18mm wide and have the exact v-shaped profile shown in the catalogs. The catalogs specify a 19mm width for the track rims but the road rims are 21mm and look nothing like what I have. The track rims in the catalog specify a weight of 310 grams. The rims I have weigh 316 grams on my not precise shipping scale.

Based upon all this I am almost certain these rims are, in fact, track specific.

http://www.wooljersey.com/gallery/broderir/Catalogs-Posters/Wholesale-R eta il-Catalogs/Catalogs-Rims/Cyclo-Pedia-1974/1974+Cyclo-Pedia+-+Page+026.jp g.h tml http://www.wooljersey.com/gallery/broderir/Catalogs-Posters/Wholesale-R eta il-Catalogs/Catalogs-Rims/Bikecology-1976/1976+Bikecology+-+Page+046.jpg. htm l?g2_imageViewsIndex=1 http://www.wooljersey.com/gallery/broderir/Catalogs-Posters/Wholesale-R eta il-Catalogs/Catalogs-Rims/Bikecology-1977/1977+Bikecology+-+Page+054.jpg. htm l?g2_imageViewsIndex=1

One last thing, they are sold and will be shipping out today.

George Allen Lexington, Kentucky USA

KO Kevin wrote:
>Without seeing your rims I can't be certain, but Fiamme was noted for
>the angled sidewalls on their tubular rims which were used for both road
>and track. I have had Fiamme red label and yellow label rims with
>angled sidewalls that were originally laced to road hubs. And yes, they
>were very narrow and also low profile. Fiamme used angled sidewalls as
>recently as the late 70's with their Ergal "Hard Silver" rims. These
>were my favorite road racing rims back in the day. My favorite track
>rims were the ultra-light Super Champion Medal D'Or.
>
>Kevin Ko
>Eugene, OR USA
>
>
>
>
>
>

-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 07:55:48 -0700 From: Bob Freitas <freitas1@pacbell.net> To: CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Cc: Michael Thompson <meauxtown@yahoo.com> Subject: [CR]re:Flying with your bike (as opposed to 'flying on your bike') Message-ID: <4874D174.9010905@pacbell.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 10

Traveling with your bike is a wonderful thing but the Airlines seem to be all over the place as to charges. Some of the following may have changed so check with the airlines BEFORE you buy your tickets.

* Lufthansa did not charge as long as your bike counted as one of 2 pieces of luggage you were allowed , this was to UK, Germany and Italy * British Air did not charge under similar circumstances to UK * American Airlines did not charge under above from UK * Continental DID charge and I think when you were only checking one bag (the bike) * Alitallia DID charge to Italy

Things to remember should you take a hard case and will return thru the same Airport you may be able to leave it at ''Left Luggage'' conversely should you have to take it with you , remember its pretty big to get around. I took a hardcase 3 years ago and it was opened a number of times in customs so by the time it got to Milano the bikes was floating around between the 2 case halves (use photos taped to

the inside to illustrate correct packing configuration) Hotels are willing to store your case (usually if you will be staying there again at the end of your trip.) I now use a soft case and liberal amounts of insulating foam to

protect the bike, side benefit of this is the bag rolls up and transports easy. Some people partially disassemble the bikes and cover them in a plastic bag (also lets workers see whats inside and hopefully not place it at the bottom of a stack of boxes.) I think airlines also allow you to just take the bike with bars turned sideways and pedals removed.

I am very interested to hear from anyone who has traveled in the past couple of months as to whats going on now. And also any successful schemes to avoid being charged.

Should you be in Tuscany the first weekend in October dont forget about L'EROICA ! I will not be attending this year but am mulling

plans for 09.

Have a Great time!!

BOB FREITAS Hot and Smoky MILL VALLEY, CA USA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 10:09:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Mikey Schmidt <mdschmidt56@verizon.net> To: CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Bob Freitas <freitas1@pacbell.net> Cc: Michael Thompson <meauxtown@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [CR]re:Flying with your bike (as opposed to 'flying on your bike') Message-ID: <27797970.653021215616191137.JavaMail.root@vms068.mailsrvcs.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 11

Michael,

And boy did Alitalia charge me last year when I flew to Italy for L'ERoica; 150 EURO each way. Continental ran $95.00 in 2006. My advice is to check with the airlines up front before booking.

Mike Schmidt Stirling, NJ USA

From: Bob Freitas <freitas1@pacbell.net> Date: 2008/07/09 Wed AM 10:55:48 EDT To: CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Cc: Michael Thompson <meauxtown@yahoo.com> Subject: [CR]re:Flying with your bike (as opposed to 'flying on your bike')

Traveling with your bike is a wonderful thing but the Airlines seem to be all over the place as to charges. Some of the following may have changed so check with the airlines BEFORE you buy your tickets.

* Lufthansa did not charge as long as your bike counted as one of 2 pieces of luggage you were allowed , this was to UK, Germany and Italy * British Air did not charge under similar circumstances to UK * American Airlines did not charge under above from UK * Continental DID charge and I think when you were only checking one bag (the bike) * Alitallia DID charge to Italy

Things to remember should you take a hard case and will return thru the same Airport you may be able to leave it at ''Left Luggage'' conversely should you have to take it with you , remember its pretty big to get around. I took a hardcase 3 years ago and it was opened a number of times in customs so by the time it got to Milano the bikes was floating around between the 2 case halves (use photos taped to

the inside to illustrate correct packing configuration) Hotels are willing to store your case (usually if you will be staying there again at the end of your trip.) I now use a soft case and liberal amounts of insulating foam to

protect the bike, side benefit of this is the bag rolls up and transports easy. Some people partially disassemble the bikes and cover them in a plastic bag (also lets workers see whats inside and hopefully not place it at the bottom of a stack of boxes.) I think airlines also allow you to just take the bike with bars turned sideways and pedals removed.

I am very interested to hear from anyone who has traveled in the past couple of months as to whats going on now. And also any successful schemes to avoid being charged.

Should you be in Tuscany the first weekend in October dont forget about L'EROICA ! I will not be attending this year but am mulling

plans for 09.

Have a Great time!!

BOB FREITAS Hot and Smoky MILL VALLEY, CA USA

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Mike Schmidt Stirling, NJ USA ------------------------------

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End of Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 67, Issue 32 *************************************************