Well, I have some perspective on this, as I own both an original and a ne w Bates, and also an Ephgrave No.1 which has been hotly debated in the past as to whether it is genuine or a fake, with very knowledgeable CR members on both sides of the debate.
One school of thought might be that this present bike should not have Ephgr ave decals unless authorized by the owner of that name whoever he might be. But it would probably require a patent/copyright lawyer to determine wh ether anyone still holds such rights or if they have lapsed, as Les Ephgrav e died nearly 40 years ago now.
I personally think I would prefer to see this decaled as something other th an Ephgrave, like Trevor Jarvis marks his Baines replicas TJ Cycles, not Ba ines. However, I think these are at least as acceptable as a Baylis-made "Colnago", in that, so far as I know, Les Ephgrave never built a frame wit h Cantiflex tubing. So unless I am wrong about that, the tubing marks this as a "tribute" much more obviously than any subtle mark Brian might ap ply to his replicas. One thing that does puzzle me is why this was marke d a Ephgrave rather than Bates, as it incorporates features of both. Per haps Ephgrave decals should have been applied on one side and Bates on the other. Except I think someone, either Martin Coopland or Ray Etherton, h olds active rights to the Bates name, so maybe that's why Ephgrave was chos en.
Regards,
Jerry Moos
Big Spring, Texas, USA
From: Harvey Sachs <hmsachs@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [CR]Cantiflex Ephgrave To: wesleygadd@sbcglobal.net, oroboyz@aol.com, "Emanuel Lowi" <lowiemanuel@ yahoo.ca>, "Classic Rendezvous" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Date: Friday, December 5, 2008, 9:02 PM
I think that Wesley "nailed" it. The one repro that Brian Bayliss did that I have seen was a lovely little track bike. He clearly marked the right crown top with his "stamp" engraved into the chromed top. No one will ever have reason to confuse the re-created with an original, and the artistry is properly acknowledged.
In the past few years, I've had two bikes repainted. Both times that I've asked that they be labelled by the painter, but it wasn't done.
I haven't always appreciated CyclArt's approach to paint, but I greatly
respect that they put their decal on the chainstay, so no one will ever think that the paint is original.
Pride might have something to do with it, of course. :-)
Emanuel Lowi's re-created Ephgrave is lovely, but is it an Ephgrave, or a Noah Rosen, or..? The copy may exceed the original (and I love my own Ephgrave, a more humble specimen), and the artist should be openly acknowledged. In my opinion.
But, these are interesting philosophical details. The bike is made, it is beautiful, and may it bring joy to builder and patron/rider alike, for many years.
Harvey Sachs mcLean VA
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I belive that Brian Baylis's masterfully done recreations are discreetly but indellibly identified as such. Is the Ephgrave recreation?
Best regards,
Wes Gadd
Unionville,CT