I've been having some discussion offlist about this bike. I have a bilaminated Claud Butler that I bought from Peter Naiman a few years ago. Never could find a serial # on the frame, but the one on the fork indicates 1950. At the time I bought it, some CR members sent me links to some 50's CB catalogs. The lug (actually sleeve) pattern looks like the one shown for the Allrounder in the mid-50's. BUT the 1954 (I think) catalog had language indicating that bilaminate construction was newly available on the Allrounder that year. So I concluded that, assuming the frame matched the fork, mine was too early to be a bilaminate Allrounder and must be a 1950 Avant Coureur instead. I speculated that the early 50's Avant Coureur might have used the "lug" pattern later used by the Allrounder when it got bilaminate construction circa 1954.
I'm interested by the name "New Allrounder", which implies there was an "old Allrounder". Could it be the New Allrounder was the bilaminate version which the catalog language suggested was introduced circa 1954, while the original Allrounder was either lugged or fillet brazed? Can anyone confirm or refute my theory that the early 50's Avant Coureur used a lug pattern similar to the later New Allrounder?
Regards,
Jerry Moos
Big Spring, Texas, USA
> From: John Betmanis <johnb@oxford.net>
\r?\n> Subject: Re: [CR] WTB Claud Butler New Allrounder or Similar
\r?\n> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
\r?\n> Date: Thursday, January 7, 2010, 9:53 PM
\r?\n> Is that Item # 130355552081 on
\r?\n> British eBay you're looking at?
\r?\n>
\r?\n> My first "real" bike was a 1953 (or '54; it was a long time
\r?\n> ago) CB New
\r?\n> Allrounder. Always wish I'd kept it. I finally snagged a
\r?\n> 1951 frame on
\r?\n> British eBay a couple of years ago (Hilary Stone) and I'm
\r?\n> slowly
\r?\n> accumulating bits to build it up after I've refinished it.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> --
\r?\n> John Betmanis Woodstock, Ontario Canada
\r?\n>
\r?\n>
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Todd Simeone wrote:
\r?\n> > Greetings CR Members..
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > My first post here, but been watching conversations
\r?\n> carefully. I recently
\r?\n> > acquired a nice Claud Butler New Allrounder frameset
\r?\n> with classic
\r?\n> > bi-laminate construction (mentioned recently on
\r?\n> CR). Maybe a little greedy
\r?\n> > with my share of the market here, but I'm looking to
\r?\n> purchase a nearly
\r?\n> > identical frameset, or full
\r?\n> bike. Currently one on ebay UK, but trying
\r?\n> to
\r?\n> > avoid 300 gbp for a beat-up frame. It
\r?\n> will be re-painted, so poor
\r?\n> > condition may be preferable to keep the price down.
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > Looking for 55 to 58 cm.
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > Here's the one I currently own:
\r?\n> > http://picasaweb.google.com/
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > Also willing to consider other fancy lug, 531
\r?\n> framesets with similar
\r?\n> > relaxed geometry. I realize this may be
\r?\n> blasphemy to some, but it will NOT
\r?\n> > be restored period correct, if this a concern. Still a
\r?\n> classy project
\r?\n> > though. Sorry.
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > Looking forward to any leads or suggestions. Thanks in
\r?\n> advance.
\r?\n> >
\r?\n> > Todd Simeone
\r?\n> > Chicago, IL USA