Re: [CR] Frame stiffness NOW Frames Getting Soft and 753

Example: Framebuilders:Bernard Carré

From: "paccoastcycles" <>
To: "Jim Merz" <>, "Angel Garcia" <>
References: <> <87DF243CE43143E68614A3D282FA5F95@laptop2> <> <> <> <>
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2010 21:05:46 -0700
Subject: Re: [CR] Frame stiffness NOW Frames Getting Soft and 753

I find this stuff very interesting, Jim. For me, one of the most interesting factors is not the actual engineering but instead, the response of the buying public to marketing and a concept that I call "Marketing Driven Folklore".

During the 80's a customer told me he had been told by a salesman that the higher model Bianchi frame was stiffer than the next model down from it. The higher model was double butted Columbus and the model below it was straight guage Columbus; both bikes being of identical geometry, the grade of tubing being the only difference. Marketing Driven Folklore.

"Stiffness" was the marketing buzz word for so much of my career, it makes me cringe. There was a spell when I had more than one person tell me that a Vitus frame was just so flexy that they just couldn't possibly ride one, even though their ride was down the Coast Highway for a cup of coffee. Meanwhile, Sean Kelly was winning Tour de France stages on a Vitus.

At the end of the day, we have facts, but for the first twenty three hours and fifty nine minutes, we have Marketing. Somehow, I find the relationship between facts and marketing interesting.

Chuck Hoefer
Pacific Coast Cycles
Oceanside, Calif.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Merz"
To: "Angel Garcia"
Sent: Tuesday, July 06, 2010 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: [CR] Frame stiffness NOW Frames Getting Soft and 753

>I think I will leave this thread alone as I will most likely get into
> trouble with this line. Or do you guys care about my input on this stuff?


> Jim Merz

> Big Sur CA