Hi, Howard --- A nice memory of Dr. Graves. Thanks for sharing. If you rode Dr. Graves' CHROMED Rene Herse tandem and he was in fact the height you say (and I've no reason to doubt you or Kevin, as you knew him and I did not), then the ORANGE tandem was either a spare of his for guests or his collection, or one he might have ridden stoker on with a taller (male?) captain. For the orange tandem is what I recalled it being, a "24 or 25-inch captain's." So I think we're both right, except I was wrong as to his height (but I was basing that height estimate purely on the seat tube of the captain's position of the orange tandem, not on the man himself). Do you ever recall seeing the ORANGE tandem in person?
http://s840.photobucket.com/
Cheerio,
Peter Jourdain Whitewater, Wisconsin USA
http://www.bicyclingbackwards.com
"For here is entertainment in excelsis, the sight, the sound and the scent of things....Why cycling for joy is not the most popular passtime on earth is still a mystery to me." ---Frank J. Urry, "SALUTE TO CYCLING"
From: Howard La Grange <howard@pacificturbine.com> Subject: Re: [CR] Timewarp Rene Herse Auction & tandem To: "Dr. Paddle" <drpaddle@yahoo.com>, "Classic" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, "Peter Jourdain" <pjourdain@yahoo.com> Date: Wednesday, February 2, 2011, 2:03 AM
Over the years many have commented on Dr. Graves. I was active in the San Diego chapter of the youth hostels from 1959 to 1968 and rode many times with him. I would estimate his height between 5'6" and 5'8". Definitively not 6'. I rode his chromed Rene Herse tandem and tike many times. Hard to understand the reference to a 25" tandem. At the time I was a teenager and never really appreciated the effort he put in prompting cycling until later in my life.
I will always remember on a trip to Yosemite, we had cooked a roast for dinner. When he was dividing it up among the group I told him how impressed I was on his craving. He simply replied he had a lot of practice. Dr. Graves was always the gentlemen. Along with many other young people, he changed my life and gave me an activity that I continue to enjoy.
Howard LaGrange
Oceanside, CA
> From: "Dr. Paddle" <drpaddle@yahoo.com>
> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 21:33:35 -0800 (PST)
> To: Classic <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Peter Jourdain
> <pjourdain@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [CR] Timewarp Rene Herse Auction & tandem
>
> If I recall correctly, Dr Graves was no six-footer. I recall, with some margin
> for memory fade, that he wasn't as tall as me (5'10"). With a bunch of
> disclaimers because of the many years, I'll bet he was closer to 5'8". A
> tandem with a 25" front would be too big for him. His singles fit me well,
> maybe a bit smaller than the 23.5" I usually rode. He gave the impression of
> being a bit diminuitive: not a physically powerful guy by any means. Of
> course, I always saw him riding in knickers, and it's hard to convey power in
> knickers.
>
> Doctor was the founder of American Youth Hostels in San Diego. He was the most
> wonderful mentor to the neighborhood kids who took up cycling. I lived just
> about a mile away from him in La Jolla Shores when he guided me into cycling.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Kevin
>
> --- On Tue, 2/1/11, Peter Jourdain <pjourdain@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Peter Jourdain <pjourdain@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [CR] Timewarp Rene Herse Auction & tandem
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Cc: "Dr. Paddle" <drpaddle@yahoo.com>, "Matt Gorski" <milanocc@gmail.com>
> Date: Tuesday, February 1, 2011, 6:08 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi, Kevin---
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for the reminiscences of Dr. Clifford Graves. Wish so much I could have
> met him.
>
>
>
>
>
> Dr. Graves' Rene Herse tandem (orange in color, I believe) sold on ebay a
> couple of years back. Somewhere I think I have the auction photos. If I find
> them I'll post 'em. It was a pretty large size, a 24 or 25-inch captain's
> cockpit. Is that the machine you recall?
>
>
>
>
> I remember there being a debate on CR about Dr. Gaves' height. Some folks,
> looking at a picture of him, thought he was quite short. But looking at his
> tandem and the size of the tubes (especially the head tube) I believe he was
> actually a 6-footer. The ebay seller had not listed the dimensions of the
> machine.
>
>
>
>
> I remember bidding on it and Matt Gorski rooting for me and asking me
> afterwards if I'd won it, which I did not. I think it might have gone for as
> much as five grand. I'll have to see if I can dig up the auction info from my
> archives.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Cheerio,
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Peter Jourdain
>
>
> Whitewater, Wisconsin USA
>
>
>
>
> http://www.bicyclingbackwards.com
>
>
> "For here is entertainment in excelsis, the sight, the sound and the scent of
> things....Why cycling for joy is not the most popular passtime on earth is
> still a mystery to me." ---Frank J. Urry, "SALUTE TO CYCLING"
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On Tue, 2/1/11, Dr. Paddle <drpaddle@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Dr. Paddle <drpaddle@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [CR] Timewarp Rene Herse Auction
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Date: Tuesday, February 1, 2011, 8:28 PM
>
>
> I visited Dr Graves' garage many times as a teen. I recall he had at that time
> (1968 to about '71) a couple chrome Herse touring bikes (one that broke apart
> for shipping) and a chrome Herse racer. He also had a tandem that may have
> been an Herse, and a tricycle from another manufacturer. At the time I hung
> out there, he was a bachelor so there wasn't a wife's bike. (He married in the
> mid-70s, I think, to Katrina Hippen?) I had the pleasure of riding the racer
> in a ten-mile timetrial a couple of times, and the tricycle once. Doctor was a
> wonderful guy.
> My memory may be incomplete or corrupted, of course. Consider the era...
>
> Kevin Montgomery
> San Diego, California USA
>
> --- On Tue, 2/1/11, Matt Gorski <milanocc@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Matt Gorski <milanocc@gmail.com>
> Subject: [CR] Timewarp Rene Herse Auction
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Cc: sterling@tns.net
> Date: Tuesday, February 1, 2011, 3:23 PM
>
>
> http://ebay.com/
> 2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm570%26_nkw%3D110639322951%2
> 6_fvi%3D1&_rdc=1
>
> Sterling,
> This is a very nice original bicycle... Very nice!~ If I didn't have a lady
> Herse project
> coming together I would be all over it. Do you know how many Herse's Dr
> Graves
> ordered through the years??
>
> Matt Gorski
> Long Beach,
> CA USA
>
>
> [edit]