Re: [CR]Use of the terms "vintage" and "classic" on E-Bay andelsewhere (long)

(Example: Component Manufacturers:Chater-Lea)

Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2003 08:58:30 -0700
From: "David Cowie" <recycle@wmni.net>
To: "classicrendezvous@bikelist.org" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
Subject: Re: [CR]Use of the terms "vintage" and "classic" on E-Bay andelsewhere (long)
References: <20031111.100841.-894239.2.airart4@juno.com>
x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"

I think terms as "vintage" "classic" are a moving target. If you are 15 yrs. old you think of the 80's (1980's) as OLD. This state considers an auto "antique" if it was made half way to 1900 from the current date or older. It changes every couple years. Advertising has always been rapid with colorful words to put a shine on a product. A buyer has to keep his mind / eye on the item, not the adjectives.

David Cowie Sutherlin Oregon

airart4@juno.com wrote:
> These are very good questions. I just had a discussion with another CR
> member about this subject. His belief is that items from the 80s can be
> vintage and even replica items from the 80s! As far as I am concerned
> there is nothing from the 80s that is "vintage" except maybe for a fine
> wine etc. I am involved with vintage aircraft and this term is only
> applied to aircraft that were built before 1940. Post 1940 they are
> termed "Classic". So I am interested to hear exactly what "vintage" means
> in the bicycle world. I also think that "salesmanship" on ebay goes way
> too far some times.
>
> Michael Short,
> Austin Texas.
>
> On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 10:19:06 -0500 "Paul Williams"
> <castell5@sympatico.ca> writes:
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > I have recently been struck by the constant over use or perhaps
> > improper use of the terms "vintage" and "classic" on E-Bay and in
> > other sales. I remember a book on "veteran," "vintage," and
> > "classic" cars my father had when I was a kid. This had a discussion
> > of these definitions and a clear idea of what they meant. Vintage
> > originally, of course, coming from the world of the wine
> > connoisseur.
> >
> > I don't want to enter into another protracted discussion here about
> > the concepts of value and "keepers of the flame" etc., however, I
> > was just struck by the fact that application of these terms is often
> > being used to justify charging higher prices, assigning a greater
> > sense of value to something, and is perhaps misleading. Am I wrong?
> > Without getting too anal about this, is there a clear idea within
> > bicycle collecting what is considered "vintage" and what is
> > considered "classic"? (I know that this is often in the eye of the
> > beholder so to speak!)
> >
> > Paul Williams,
> > Ottawa "where it is beginning to snow this morning" ON, Canada
> >
> >
> > P.S. In a search for a clear idea of how car collectors are
> > thinking, I found two examples (of course this is often country
> > dependant):
> >
> > http://www.motorsm.com/classic_cars.htm
> >
> > "What makes a car a "classic"? This is a difficult question that no
> > two car enthusiast will agree on. Therefore we apologize at the
> > outset for omissions of cars that you consider to be a "classic".
> > What follows is a subjective selection based on combination of :
> > a.. design innovation
> > b.. enduring appeal
> > c.. performance
> > d.. aesthetics
> > e.. age (at least 20 years old).
> > f.. Timeframe:
> > a.. 1900-1908 Veteran Cars
> > b.. 1909-1930 Vintage Cars
> > c.. 1931- Classic Car"
> > http://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/classic_intro.htm
> >
> > "Probably the most discussed question raised by people with a new
> > found interest in older cars, is 'What is a Classic Car?'. Finding
> > an answer to this question ranks with establishing the meaning of
> > life (well almost), as there can be no other debate likely to raise
> > the hackles of one group of enthusiasts or another. ... Older cars
> > can be grouped more or less by the year they were made, such as with
> > vintage and veteran cars for instance, vintage cars (as defined by
> > the Vintage Sports Car Club I think) are anything built pre-1930. A
> > car built between 1930 and WW2 is generally classed as being a Post
> > Vintage Thoroughbred, quite a grand moniker for many cars that fall
> > into this group, which at the time were less than grand. After this
> > time things get significantly less clear, with the term 'Classic
> > Car' being applied by various quarters to any car from the 1940s
> > right through in some cases to the 1980s even. ... At the end of
> > the day, the term 'classic car' is now accepted as applying to any
> > car over say 15 years of age that has some fan base to draw upon,
> > with one or two exceptions for truly interesting more recent
> > automobiles. "
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
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