[CR]Bruce's post

(Example: Framebuilders:Cecil Behringer)

In-Reply-To: <MONKEYFOODEYtN3Isam000032c8@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org>
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From: "Dennis Young" <mail@woodworkingboy.com>
Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2006 10:22:32 +0900
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
cc: internet-bob@bikelist.org
cc: touring@phred.org
cc: internet-bob@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]Bruce's post

Bruce,

I hear the pain, know it like the back of my hand. I'd like to take the liberty of giving my perspective to what you express. It isn't a direct commentary on the points you raise, but rather a generality in terms of the issue of getting justly compensated for your work if you are a artisan in the states. So, let me start out by suggesting that instead of you feeling dejected about it, you should be feeling fortunate about it, that is in referring to the location where you work. The market for quality hand made goods in the US is HUGE. Am I being an idiot in thinking that this also includes bicycles? Sure, there are swings in the economy, competition from other people doing similar or dis-similar work, that may all be lumped together by a less than totally informed public, natural disasters, etc, but from my experience as being a thirty plus year craftsman doing high end work in three comparatively diverse culture countries, including the US, if you can't make it in the states, the likelihood is that you can't make it anywhere. I think of the US as the mecca for artisans. That doesn't guarantee a living to the standard one might wish for, but still in terms of the potential, you can't beat it. I think that aside from the luck factor, you have to be very smart about your business approach. Just doing good work isn't the end all to success, then there is the "beating of the pavement" required to assemble your fan club, and being open to a certain flexibility as the situation changes over time, all this and more. For most of us, doing the work is the easy part, it is the marketing and business side that is less than inspiring...the whatever it takes to stay in business. I saw this so clearly when I was an apprentice in Japan, where I began my career. I could visit any number of shops doing world class work in different disciplines. When the bubble years came rolling through, those same shops where the fire had been lit for sometimes many generations, started to throw in the towel as work seriously lessened. Eventually they dropped off like flies. Most of these guys entered their trades in their early teens, sometimes younger, their world was pretty much restricted to the four walls of their shops, and the guarantee of customers seeking them out was always evident. When the situation required different, they weren't up for it, were frozen in their ability to respond. This is still true with contemporary craftsmen as a whole, we are slow to make changes, the demands in the shop are about enough in themselves. I observed that in the states, people generally have a very good eye for quality as a rule. Sure, they are subject to fashion trends and whims of fancy, but still.... and one other aspect that much strikes a chord with me, is that customers there want to see the artisan compensated to a satisfied level for his efforts. In knowing that they are getting a schooled and disciplined heart felt commodity, it makes them pleased to give what is required in return. That is a major plus for a craftsman, to be working in a culture where people are so kindly (I won't say generous) about it. Once you leave the confines of the "sea to shining sea", the kindliness factor rapidly drops away, and more people take the approach that better for less is preferred. There also is the major problem of lack of awareness of what the artisan is doing, in terms of generally poor sensitivity to the accomplishment. Craftsmen are often seen as "school leavers", resigned to working with their hands for lack of a better education. This in a country where the level of hand made originality and quality were unsurpassed on the planet. Of course, all of this is a generalization, and regardless of the business environment, being a artisan doing work to high standards yet surviving or hopefully even better, is not something for the faint of heart. I don't mean to lecture about it, and if I have projected so, please excuse such expression. You do excellent work, you should be getting justly compensated for it, I just want to take the liberty of reminding that you are in a place where it is possible to get what you need, no doubt more so than anywhere, so perhaps the answer is less to look about you for the reasons otherwise, and more to look within you for the strength and awareness to make your task an easier one.

Be optimistic, Keep the faith!

Dennis Young Hotaka, Japan
>
> """""While I find this to be very interesting, I'm not sure what
> to do with this information. Perhaps I'm confused with what
> your desired affect is with putting this information out."""""
>
> Someone asked my purpose in writing about this.
> I'm writing to expose "the dirty little secret of the bike biz",
> that no one
> wants to talk about.
> First I want to commend Don for the show. It was the most unique
> gathering
> I have been to in my 35 years in the bike business, it was also the
> most
> troubling.
> I write this because I think most of the visitors are totally
> unaware of the
> plight of the small builder.
> First - I really like bikes, I like making them, I like thinking
> about them,
> I like riding them - I hate the bike business. Like many of you -
> I might
> say that I am passionate about bikes.
> One of the most disturbing moments of the weekend was when I was
> having
> dinner at the hotel after spending an exhausting day at the show
> talking to
> people. A builder whom I really respect, who has been building
> about as
> long as I have, quietly ordered a bowl of soup. I could tell it
> was not
> because he was not hungry - it was because entrees were $15 to $20.
> In the last 18 months I have been to 5 shows like the NAHBS. Don's
> show in
> San Jose was the biggest. I have been to the Velo Rendezvous in
> Pasadena 2
> times, the Cirque in North Carolina, and the Handmade Bike Fair in
> Tokyo
> Japan. In each show except the NAHBS I have won first place awards
> for my
> bikes. I am humbled and honored by the awards. However, it has
> cost over
> $20,000 with almost no sales. I have sold 3 frames in the last 16
> years. I
> was hoping to sell some of the prize winners at the NAHBS show to
> recoup
> some of my expenses. No luck (they are still all for sale) and I
> spent
> $2000 to attend and display.
> Making the fancy lugged frames bikes is very therapeutic for me.
> It gets me
> back to my roots.
> At the NAHBS I got to talk to some builders I have known and
> admired for 30+
> years. We talked bikes, but we also talked business. I handed out an
> anonymous questionnaire I had printed up about the business. Some
> of the
> answers might shock you. The first question was "what should a
> competent
> frame builder earn a year?" The most common answer was $40,000 to
> $50,000
> per year - certainly not Greedy. I have a 30 year old friend who
> is a Union
> Plumber who just turned Journeyman. He just started a job in San
> Francisco
> doing copper piping in a new Condominium at $43 per hour + health
> coverage +
> retirement. I should have been a plumber. I could have afforded
> to go the
> Plumbing Shows and show off my fancy edged carved Copper plumbing
> fittings.
> I found in the questionnaire that no one including the well known
> small
> builders even made $35,000. Most were about $20,000, which is
> where I fit
> in. I asked if they could ever retire on their current income -
> everyone
> replied NO. As for health insurance - 75% had no insurance, or if
> they had
> insurance - most had it through their spouse.
> When I started building in 1974 with Albert Eisentraut he would
> say: "You
> won't get rich building frames, but, you can make a living."
> For the first 28 years of my business I could always afford an
> employee,
> that has not been the case for the last 4 years. Even working
> alone I have
> had to dip into my personal savings to pay the bills. If sales
> stay the
> same, I have 1 or 2 more years left before my savings are gone.
> Most of my business for the last 16 years has been making more
> utilitarian
> TIG welded touring frames and racks. But even those TIGed bike
> sales have
> dropped from 60 to 70 bikes a year to 25 last year. Is it because
> my stuff
> is lousy?? I don't think so. I think I make pretty good,
> reasonably priced
> touring stuff.
> What has happened is that the business has been taken over by what
> I call
> "Marketers". People who have discovered that "Why make it yourself
> if you
> can have it made overseas for a lot less?". That way you can spend
> more on
> marketing, which seems to work better. Fine, some will say, THAT IS
> CAPITALISM!. But, something to think about is this. Over the past
> 30 odd
> years I have seen many innovations in the bike biz. Almost all
> were from 1
> to 3 person shops. A couple that come to mind are Merlin, the
> first viable
> Titanium frames (early TI attempts, Teledyne, etc. just did not
> work) and
> especially Mountain Bikes. Now, if you go into a bike shop - 90 to
> 95% of
> Mountain Bikes are made in Taiwan or China. If we were to wait for
> the
> Taiwanese or Chinese to invent the Mountain Bike - we would still be
> waiting.
> One of my most vivid memories of my first trip to France in the
> late 1980's
> was that it was a country that almost everyone drove French cars. Not
> because they were the best, they weren't (they have vastly improved
> since),
> but because they were built by French people, and they liked to
> support
> their own industry.
> What has hurt my business the most are the Rivendells, Surlys, Somas,
> Kogswells, etc. I AM NOT TALKING ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THEIR
> PRODUCTS!!!!!
> When Rivendell started - they were only going to be made in USA,
> then, maybe
> some made in Japan, then, OK maybe some from Taiwan. It is a slippery
> slope, and there is NO chairlift back to the top of the mountain.
> For me in California, I cannot compete with a $249 wholesale Surly
> Touring
> frame. I know the argument - we are better in the USA doing the
> designing
> and outsourcing the production. B.S. - People in India, Taiwan and
> China
> have the same computers we have. In fact, my Hewlett Packard
> computer as
> made in China. They also have people who can use them. The only
> jobs that
> can not be outsourced are the jobs pouring your coffee at
> Starbucks, and the
> job wearing an "Orange Apron" and saying - "Welcome to Home Depot".
> That gets me back to the question of why I wrote the original
> post. If we
> want to have the passionate, small, innovative builders - we have
> to start
> buying from them. We need to buy from the people who are
> passionate about
> building them, NOT just from the passionate people who Market
> them. I doubt
> that the factory workers in Taiwan, or China, etc. are passionate
> about
> bikes like you are.
>
> If you got this far - thanks for reading and letting me get this
> off my
> chest.
> Regards,
> Bruce Gordon
> Bruce Gordon Cycles
> http://www.bgcycles.com
>
> Thanks, Bruce.
> I agree completely.
> We are living in a country of greed and capitalism gone berserk and
> our only
> loyalties are to cheap price and buying frenzy of credit by a
> populace that
> has been brainwashed by Madison Avenue.
> I won't tell you how I really think about it.
> It's not just the bike game and superbe artists and craftsmen like
> you, but
> our whole society plunging headfirst down the slope to 3rd and 4th
> world
> status.
> Sic Transit Gloria!, them's that eat the fastest, get the mostest!
> Ted Ernst
> Palos verdes Estates, C