No offense, Barrie, but there's an old truism that states - "perception is reality". I'd like to hear from Norris, Crumpy, and anyone else who was part of the scene (whichever version of the scene they were part of at least) for their take on it. What I hear you say is consistent with what I've heard in other places in some regards, but perhaps a bit overstrongly stated. Don Gillies' recollection of youthful days when his riding pals had a disdain for those who "overspent" on Campagnolo components comes to mind. It may have been true in the circles in which he traveled, but it wasn't a universal attitude amongst midwesterners of the time.
>From what I gather, showing up on a ride with your Dawes or Raleigh and expecting to draw gushing admiration from the others would have been unrealistic, but would it have been the black mark against one's name that you seem to indicate?
After spending altogether too much time shoveling snow this past week, I'd gladly trade winter away for the sorriest British club machine.
Cheers,
John Barry (yes, it's spelled right - just ask Mike) ;) Mechanicsburg, PA, USA
p.s. - I'm enjoying the discussion, and honestly trying to get a clearer impression of the time and place I didn't have the fortune to be a part of.
> From: barrie carter <barriemgracer@yahoo.co.uk>
\r?\n> Subject: Re: [CR] Dawes, snobbery, photo posting
\r?\n> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
\r?\n> Date: Monday, February 8, 2010, 6:08 PM
\r?\n> Did Byron speak Spanish? Tomaaaaato
\r?\n> or tomato" Beauty is in the eye of the beholder but
\r?\n> Some people just have no appreciation of it. I can only
\r?\n> tell you of ACTUAL experience of many many makes,owning,
\r?\n> touring and racing, and with that experience, I stand by my
\r?\n> words.
\r?\n> Therees more but let the matter rest and look at Hilary
\r?\n> Stones words. Facts and unbiased truth. Only one question
\r?\n> Hilary, what did you ride when a young, sorry , youger
\r?\n> shaver?
\r?\n> Experience from books is no experience.
\r?\n> Night Night all. Its getting cold again, weve got your snow
\r?\n> coming , time to tuck up with my 1960s Sporting Cyclist. Now
\r?\n> thats really sick.....
\r?\n> Barrie Carter. Roundham. UK
\r?\n>
\r?\n>
\r?\n>
\r?\n> ________________________________
\r?\n> From: David Bean <beandk@rcn.com>
\r?\n> To: CR List <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
\r?\n> Sent: Mon, 8 February, 2010 15:29:15
\r?\n> Subject: Re: [CR] Dawes, snobbery, photo posting
\r?\n>
\r?\n> This thread has been the greatest. Full of facts,
\r?\n> opinion, prejudice, the
\r?\n> whole works!
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Thank you, Peter, for putting the Don Juan photos on a site
\r?\n> that doesn't
\r?\n> make you sign up.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Now, the question: Pronunciation always has to do with
\r?\n> snobbery; how do we
\r?\n> prounounce "Don Juan" correctly? As in Spanish or as the
\r?\n> title of Byron's
\r?\n> poem is pronounced?
\r?\n>
\r?\n> And, as for bike snobbery of the ordinary sort, how could
\r?\n> anyone look down
\r?\n> their nose at a bike as totally splendid as Mark Hoffman's
\r?\n> Dawes?
\r?\n>
\r?\n> David Bean
\r?\n> Arlington, MA USA
\r?\n> beandk at are-see-enn dot com